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Thread: Supreme Court & conservative activists could prevent Obama from becoming President

  1. #16
    Elite Member KandyKorn's Avatar
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    He's still a citizen so I don't understand what the shitfit is about?
    I'm not quite drunk enough to really care, but is this her violation of her violation of her violation of her violation of probation or her violation of her violation of her violation of her probation????? ~MontanaMama on LL's latest arrest.

  2. #17
    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    I think the court agreed to put this on the calendar so they can strike it down.

    they can't kill conspiracy theories but they can strike down cases
    It's no longer a dog whistle, it's a fucking trombone


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  3. #18
    Elite Member MontanaMama's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KandyKorn View Post
    He's still a citizen so I don't understand what the shitfit is about?
    The Constitution states that to be qualified to run for President, you must be 35 years of age and a "natural born" citizen - meaning born on US soil (be it physically in the US or on US territory abroad like a military base). This is why Ahhhnold can be the guvinator, but could never run for President because he is a naturalized citizen, not a natural born citizen.

    What is is interesting is that McCain did/does not meet that requirement and all we hear are conspiracy theories about Obama's birth.

  4. #19
    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    ^^ McCain was born on a US Naval Base in the Panama Canal Zone...US soil.

    The Panama Canal zone was controlled by the US from 1903-1979.

    So you've answered your own question. And there was action taken by the US senate this year in regard to McCain's eligibility.
    It's no longer a dog whistle, it's a fucking trombone


    All of God's children are not beautiful. Most of God's children are, in fact, barely presentable.


    If I wanted the government in my womb I'd fuck a Senator

  5. #20
    Elite Member kingcap72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SSDiva View Post
    What does it say?? I can't see it on my phone.
    He said he was born on Krypton, and sent here by his father Jor-El.

  6. #21
    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
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    Here's the other thing. These plaintiffs to the USSC also seem to believe that the Hawaii birth certificate is a fake. And that he was actually born in Kenya or some other African country.

    And if he had been born there, his father's citizenship with Kenya would have canceled out his mom's because you can't have dual citizenship with Kenya. Something like that.

  7. #22
    Elite Member MontanaMama's Avatar
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    Withcgurl - There is some question that McCain was born on the naval base, as he doesn't appear in any Panamanian records (as other US servicepeople's children were and his birth certificate was never released) and the Senate action had no force behind it and carried no legal authority. I'm not saying I don't think McCain should have been qualified to run or serve as POTUS. Nevertheless, I just think it odd that there's such a double standard.

  8. #23
    Elite Member nana55's Avatar
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    This is all so stupid. Why would they hide the fact for years that he was born in Kenya. I imagine as a child it would have been kind of cool. I guess they knew that one day he would run for president and they better lie to everyone and get a fake birth certificate. Some people are so deserate to stop a man of color from being president they will do anything. They actually have a better case against McCain. Oh they also claim because Obama's mother was under 18 he can't use her citizenship to claim his as she was underage when she gave birth. The law has since changed apparently. It's all bulsh**
    If I can't be a good example, then let me be a horrible warning.

  9. #24
    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nana55 View Post
    This is all so stupid. Why would they hide the fact for years that he was born in Kenya. I imagine as a child it would have been kind of cool. I guess they knew that one day he would run for president and they better lie to everyone and get a fake birth certificate. Some people are so deserate to stop a man of color from being president they will do anything. They actually have a better case against McCain. Oh they also claim because Obama's mother was under 18 he can't use her citizenship to claim his as she was underage when she gave birth. The law has since changed apparently. It's all bulsh**
    I don't think that very many of them care about Obama's color as much as his political leanings. They would have been fine with Condoleeza Rice as President, but not Obama.

    Anyway, with each new appointment, Obama seems to be proving he isn't quite as liberal as some conservatives had feared.

  10. #25
    Elite Member Fluffy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by witchcurlgirl View Post
    ^^ McCain was born on a US Naval Base in the Panama Canal Zone...US soil.

    The Panama Canal zone was controlled by the US from 1903-1979.

    So you've answered your own question. And there was action taken by the US senate this year in regard to McCain's eligibility.
    Except that the law that made this possible was passed in 1937, a year after McCain was born. Two scholars actually looked at this and said that the law that was passed wasn't retroactive, so McCain legally could not be president. Of course, it didn't get all the attention that Obama did from the wingnuts.

    Abstract:
    Senator McCain was born in 1936 in the Canal Zone to U.S. citizen parents. The Canal Zone was territory controlled by the United States, but it was not incorporated into the Union. As requested by Senator McCain's campaign, distinguished constitutional lawyers Laurence Tribe and Theodore Olson examined the law and issued a detailed opinion offering two reasons that Senator McCain was a natural born citizen. Neither is sound under current law. The Tribe-Olson Opinion suggests that the Canal Zone, then under exclusive U.S. jurisdiction, may have been covered by the Fourteenth Amendment's grant of citizenship to "all persons born . . . in the United States." However, in the Insular Cases, the Supreme Court held that "unincorporated territories" were not part of the United States for constitutional purposes. Accordingly, many decisions hold that persons born in unincorporated territories are not Fourteenth Amendment citizens. The Tribe-Olson Opinion also suggests that Senator McCain obtained citizenship by statute. However, the only statute in effect in 1936 did not cover the Canal Zone. Recognizing the gap, in 1937, Congress passed a citizenship law applicable only to the Canal Zone, granting Senator McCain citizenship, but eleven months too late for him to be a citizen at birth. Because Senator John McCain was not a citizen at birth, he is not a "natural born Citizen" and thus is not "eligible to the Office of President" under the Constitution.

    This essay concludes by exploring how changes in constitutional law implied by the Tribe-Olson Opinion, such as limiting the Insular Cases and expanding judicial review of immigration and nationality laws passed by Congress, could make Senator McCain a citizen at birth and thus a natural born citizen.
    SSRN-Why Senator John McCain Cannot Be President: Eleven Months and a Hundred Yards Short of Citizenship by Gabriel Chin
    Last edited by Fluffy; December 5th, 2008 at 03:43 PM. Reason: added quote

  11. #26
    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
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    According to Gabriel Chin:

    "distinguished constitutional lawyers Laurence Tribe and Theodore Olson examined the law and issued a detailed opinion offering two reasons that Senator McCain was a natural born citizen."

    Then, Chin disagrees with their opinions. Why would we believe Chin's thesis instead of Olsen and Tribe (who is considered a liberal guy and no friend of McCain?)

  12. #27
    Elite Member Fluffy's Avatar
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    ^Olson is a friend of McCain's and was an advisor to him, which means his analysis is not neutral. Even still, the 1937 law was not retroactive.

  13. #28
    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fluffy View Post
    ^Olson is a friend of McCain's and was an advisor to him, which means his analysis is not neutral. Even still, the 1937 law was not retroactive.
    I agree that Olssen is very conservative. I think he was solicitor general under Bush. But with Tribe, it sounds like you have bipartisan agreement that the issue would not have applied to McCain.

  14. #29
    Elite Member Fluffy's Avatar
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    ^You're forgetting that Chin is basing his on past precedent. That "unincorporated territories" were not part of the United States for constitutional purposes. The Panama Canal was an "unicorporated territory" when John McCain was born and the law passed in 1937 was not retroactive.

  15. #30
    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fluffy View Post
    ^You're forgetting that Chin is basing his on past precedent. That "unincorporated territories" were not part of the United States for constitutional purposes. The Panama Canal was an "unicorporated territory" when John McCain was born and the law passed in 1937 was not retroactive.
    But once again, you are pitting Chin against both Tribe and Olsen. I have to admit I haven't looked at the merits of Chin's arguments in detail yet, but it's hard to imagine that his argument would carry more weight than Tribe's and Olsen's Especially because Tribe, who had very little need or desire to support McCain's ambitions, has argued more than 34 cases before the Supreme Court, and is considered one of the foremost constitutional lawyers in the United States.

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