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Thread: Right calls Supreme Court nominee Sonia Sotomayor racist over line in talk

  1. #16
    Elite Member MontanaMama's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JamieElizabeth View Post
    The only reason I posted it is because I have been ridiculed for posting items. I didn't take anything out of context.
    Huh? I didn't quote your post and wasn't referring to it, I was referring to the original comment.
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    Quote Originally Posted by shedevilang View Post
    (Replying to MontanaMama) This is some of the smartest shit I ever read

  2. #17
    Elite Member JamieElizabeth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MontanaMama View Post
    Huh? I didn't quote your post and wasn't referring to it, I was referring to the original comment.
    Oop. But I'm the one who had been posting this stuff in the beginning. That Grimm say is nonsensical.
    But I get ya.

  3. #18
    Elite Member MontanaMama's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by crumpet View Post
    "I would hope that a wise Latina woman with the richness of her experiences would more often than not reach a better conclusion than a white male who hasn't lived that life," she said.

    Well, that was a stupid comment to make. It's as stupid as some conservative's comment that she isn't qualified because she isn't married and a parent. Some things just sound stupid and shouldn't be said publicly, no matter how you mean it. And you know if some man said being male made him a naturally inclined leader or some shit like that people would be pissed. I'm all for seeing a court and legislative body that looks like what the rest of the country looks like: not all white, male, or straight,or religious. But quit saying stupid shit. I read her comments and didn't see any 'context'. Taking something out of context would mean, for example, I walk past your office and overhear you talking to your friend about how you heard someone else say that the boss 'is an asshole'. Then, I go back and tell the boss I heard you tell your friend that he is an asshole. That is taking something out of context.

    I actually agree that we benefit from having a diverse body of people on the court and I think it is fine to highlight that you bring a fresh persepctive to the court or that your background may be unique in ways that enrich the perspective of the court. But to hint that your gender or ethnicity somehow make you 'reach a better conclusion', you are asking for trouble. It was stupid.

    Oh, and it is nothing short of comedy when Rush and his ilk get all defensive about racism and sexism, as if they are none of those awful things. This is the dickweed who accused the media of sexism against Palin soon after making fun of Hilary by saying no one would want to watch a woman get old in the White House.
    You make excellent points. But, I do think that the sentence is being taken out of context because she didn't just walk up to a microphone and say it. It was her response to the position that so long as a jurist is "wise" they will reach the same conclusion no matter what gender. She said it poorly, but I agree with the point. To me, something taken out of context means that it means one thing with the surrounding information but may mean something totally different standing on its own.
    If i hear one more personal attack, i will type while drunk, then you can cry! - Bugdoll
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    Quote Originally Posted by shedevilang View Post
    (Replying to MontanaMama) This is some of the smartest shit I ever read

  4. #19
    Elite Member ManxMouse's Avatar
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    I agree completely with Crumpet. There is not enough "context" to make that statement all right. It's a lame thing to say, no matter your political affiliation.
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  5. #20
    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    I also agree with Crumpet.

    It was a stupid thing to say, and it's come out that she has said it over and over, not just in that one speech, so the 'out of context' defense of it is moot.

    It certainly doesn't make her a bad choice for the court, but she should know better than to say it, and to keep saying it. A truly wise person would get that.
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  6. #21
    Elite Member kingcap72's Avatar
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    It was a stupid think for Sotomayor to say, especially since she said it more than once. But the GOP still has no room to go after her and blast her as a 'racist' and call her intelligence into question when some of them have said far worse things.

  7. #22
    Hit By Ban Bus! AliceInWonderland's Avatar
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    maybe dealing with racists and sexists all her life turned her into that, but i doubt it. the woman is highly educated and extremely intelligent. STFU critics!

    i dont think its a stupid comment she had, i think its the truth! i too would hope a latina woman would and could rise past the constraints put on her by society and cultural ideals in turn being more intelligent than a white male in this country b/c they're the ones who don't have to try as hard just due to those 2 factors.

  8. #23
    Elite Member nycgirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingcap72 View Post
    Too bad more conservatives like this aren't running the GOP.

    And considering that you have a bunch of white male conservatives openly questioning a Hispanic woman's intelligence they should really watch the racist tag, because they look racist and sexist.

    Hell, Karl Rove even went so far as to say that he knew plenty of stupid people who went to Ivy League schools (namely his boss for the last 8 years)
    Lol, I wonder if any of them graduated summa cum laude like Sotomayor did. That's quite an achievement at any college, let alone Princeton. At the same time I'm not surprised Rove is spewing his crap at anyone who will listen, he's probably pretty desperate these days. And his boss would have to be stupid to hire and keep him.


    Anyways I think this quote is really getting blown out of proportion. Sure, she could have worded her statement better (i.e. would reach a different conclusion, not a better one)... but really, calling the woman racist is taking it too far. She seems like a highly qualified and bright person, from what I've seen so far.

  9. #24
    Elite Member Cali's Avatar
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    Rachel Maddow reported last night that to fight against Sotomayer's nomination, the GOP has hired the PR company behind the Swift Boat Veterans debacle. So yeah.. this may just be the beginning of a long line of ugly attacks.

    Also, here's the context of this quote: it came from a lecture she did at Boalt Hall (UC Berkeley's law school) that is part of a lecture series established by a respected Latino judge. The purpose of the lecture series is to 'perpetuate the Judge's abiding commitment to the development of law promoting equality and justice for all people.' It was also part of a symposium called "Raising the Bar: Latino and Latina Presence in the Judiciary and the Struggle for Representation."

    You can read the full speech here: The New York Times > Log In

    But here's the immediate context of that sentence (long but a good read):

    'In our private conversations, Judge Cedarbaum has pointed out to me that seminal decisions in race and sex discrimination cases have come from Supreme Courts composed exclusively of white males. I agree that this is significant but I also choose to emphasize that the people who argued those cases before the Supreme Court which changed the legal landscape ultimately were largely people of color and women. I recall that Justice Thurgood Marshall, Judge Connie Baker Motley, the first black woman appointed to the federal bench, and others of the NAACP argued Brown v. Board of Education. Similarly, Justice Ginsburg, with other women attorneys, was instrumental in advocating and convincing the Court that equality of work required equality in terms and conditions of employment.

    Whether born from experience or inherent physiological or cultural differences, a possibility I abhor less or discount less than my colleague Judge Cedarbaum, our gender and national origins may and will make a difference in our judging. Justice O'Connor has often been cited as saying that a wise old man and wise old woman will reach the same conclusion in deciding cases. I am not so sure Justice O'Connor is the author of that line since Professor Resnik attributes that line to Supreme Court Justice Coyle. I am also not so sure that I agree with the statement. First, as Professor Martha Minnow has noted, there can never be a universal definition of wise. Second, I would hope that a wise Latina woman with the richness of her experiences would more often than not reach a better conclusion than a white male who hasn't lived that life.

    Let us not forget that wise men like Oliver Wendell Holmes and Justice Cardozo voted on cases which upheld both sex and race discrimination in our society. Until 1972, no Supreme Court case ever upheld the claim of a woman in a gender discrimination case. I, like Professor Carter, believe that we should not be so myopic as to believe that others of different experiences or backgrounds are incapable of understanding the values and needs of people from a different group. Many are so capable. As Judge Cedarbaum pointed out to me, nine white men on the Supreme Court in the past have done so on many occasions and on many issues including Brown.

    However, to understand takes time and effort, something that not all people are willing to give. For others, their experiences limit their ability to understand the experiences of others. Other simply do not care. Hence, one must accept the proposition that a difference there will be by the presence of women and people of color on the bench. Personal experiences affect the facts that judges choose to see. My hope is that I will take the good from my experiences and extrapolate them further into areas with which I am unfamiliar. I simply do not know exactly what that difference will be in my judging. But I accept there will be some based on my gender and my Latina heritage.

    I also hope that by raising the question today of what difference having more Latinos and Latinas on the bench will make will start your own evaluation. For people of color and women lawyers, what does and should being an ethnic minority mean in your lawyering? For men lawyers, what areas in your experiences and attitudes do you need to work on to make you capable of reaching those great moments of enlightenment which other men in different circumstances have been able to reach. For all of us, how do change the facts that in every task force study of gender and race bias in the courts, women and people of color, lawyers and judges alike, report in significantly higher percentages than white men that their gender and race has shaped their careers, from hiring, retention to promotion and that a statistically significant number of women and minority lawyers and judges, both alike, have experienced bias in the courtroom?

    Each day on the bench I learn something new about the judicial process and about being a professional Latina woman in a world that sometimes looks at me with suspicion. I am reminded each day that I render decisions that affect people concretely and that I owe them constant and complete vigilance in checking my assumptions, presumptions and perspectives and ensuring that to the extent that my limited abilities and capabilities permit me, that I reevaluate them and change as circumstances and cases before me requires. I can and do aspire to be greater than the sum total of my experiences but I accept my limitations. I willingly accept that we who judge must not deny the differences resulting from experience and heritage but attempt, as the Supreme Court suggests, continuously to judge when those opinions, sympathies and prejudices are appropriate.'

  10. #25
    Hit By Ban Bus! AliceInWonderland's Avatar
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    WTF is their problem?! is this why you were voted into office asshats?!

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