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Thread: Major U.S. news sources claiming Osama Bin Laden is dead

  1. #226
    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    I don't think a trial would have been more dangerous to the general public than military execution. A trial wouldn't have had to take place in the US at all. Al-Qaeda has committed world wide acts of terrorism, London, Spain, Africa, the Middle East. America isn't the only victim. The ICC could have headed it up, and there are plenty of remote, secure locations in the world. If they're going to attack, they're going to attack. His death instead of trial doesn't negate or even lower that chance.

    As of this morning the White House is starting to walk back the story about whether he was armed, or used a woman as a shield, and which son was killed.



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  2. #227
    Elite Member celeb_2006's Avatar
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    Frenemies: U.S. ally in hot seat after bin Laden found in Pakistani army town - Yahoo! News

    U.S. officials have left little doubt that they did not sufficiently trust their counterparts in Pakistan to keep quiet on the plan to send a team of U.S. special forces and CIA operatives into the country on Sunday to kill Osama bin Laden. And now that the whole world knows U.S. forces found and killed bin Laden in a large, conspicuously fortified compound in an affluent Pakistani military town less than forty miles from the Pakistani capital of Islamabad, American officials are likewise making it clear that they don't fully buy the Pakistani government's see-no-evil line on bin Laden's whereabouts. It's hard for Pakistani military leaders in particular to make a credible case that they were shocked--shocked!--to learn bin Laden was right there under their noses; the Paksitani army, after all, has a college in Abbottabad only a few hundred feet from the compound where bin Laden was found and killed.
    "It's inconceivable that Bin Laden did not have a support system inside the country," White House counter-terrorism adviser John Brennan told journalists at the White House press conference Monday.
    Bin Laden's "presence outside the capital raises questions we are discussing with Pakistani officials," he said. But Pakistani officials profess themselves to be "as surprised as we were that bin Laden was holding out in that area," he added.
    In other words--gimme a break.
    Of course, the official line in Pakistan is that the country has been a loyal and energetic ally for the United States in the struggle against Islamist terrorism. In an op-ed in Tuesday's Washington Post, Pakistani President Asif Ali Zardari contended that while Pakistani officials did not take part in the raid on the bin Laden compound, the action nonetheless arose out of "a decade of co-operation and partnership between Pakistan and the United States." He also noted that"we in Pakistan take some satisfaction that our early assistance in identifying an al-Qaeda courier ultimately led to this day."
    The U.S. version of events doesn't reflect nearly as well on the Pakistani military. In revisiting the highly classified commando operation for reporters, Brennan pointedly reiterated the degree to which American officials kept their Pakistani counterparts out of the loop about the details of its execution. To carry out the 40 minute raid, Brennan explained, U.S. military planners had to take pains to move in and out of the country without having to shoot at Pakistani military forces:
    "We were watching to make sure we could get out of Pakistani air space and to minimize the prospect of engagement with Pakistani forces," Brennan described. "No Pakistani forces were engaged. There were no forces killed aside from those on the compound."
    Welcome, in other words, to the twilight zone alliance between the United States and Pakistan: alleged allies who sometimes seem to be double-crossing enemies--or what American high school students would call frenemies.
    But Brennan's further comments also explain why the U.S.-Pakistani alliance, for all its "ambiguity," mutual secrets, and occasionally covert but sometimes outright armed hostility, is one that neither country can live without.
    "I will point out, that while we have had differences of view on counterterrorism cooperation on what we think they should and should not be doing, Pakistan has been responsible for capturing and killing more terrorists than any other country and by a wide margin," Brennan said. "And many Pakistanis have given their lives ... Although there are some differences of views, we believe our partnership is critically important to breaking the back of al Qaeda."
    So why do elements of the Pakistani security services persist in supporting the jihadi terrorists trying to kill U.S.-led forces in Afghanistan and Afghans? And why can't the United States just declare Pakistan a hostile enemy, if that's how significant reaches of Pakistani officialdom are behaving?
    There is no simple answer--but the basic truth here is that the United States would be in far worse shape without even the highly imperfect Pakistani government cooperation American officials are now getting. For all the shortcomings of the current U.S.-Pakistani alliance, it would be far worse for the United States to be confronting an openly hostile South Asian terrorist-backing state that has the fastest growing nuclear arsenal in the world and a bitter ongoing fixation on the ambitions of neighboring rival India.
    Still, the U.S. discovery of bin Laden in a million dollar, highly fortified compound in the Pakistani military town of Abbottabad, population 90,000, on property only a few hundred feet from major Pakistani military installations, is certainly bringing out into the open what has more often been discussed behind closed doors between U.S. and Pakistani spy chiefs and generals.
    "There's no question that once dust settles a little bit that Pakistan is going to be brought under a very harsh light," said former Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage, who has worked closely with Pakistani civilian and military leaders. "It's not credible that this could guy could live as close to the Pakistani equivalent of Sandhurst"--the elite British military training school--"and someone in Pakistani intelligence did not see outside his villa. That raises questions of its own."
    While "it puts a harsher spotlight on Pakistan, it does not however relieve the U.S. of the need to try to work with Pakistan in particular for the betterment of Afghanistan," Armitage added.
    "In the short run, this has the potential to make U.S.-Pakistan relations even worse," said Daniel Markey, a South Asian expert with the Council on Foreign Relations. "It is an embarrassment for Pakistan's military and intelligence, given the location, and it follows on the heels of these other 'violations of Pakistani territorial sovereignty'--drones, [CIA contractor] Raymond Davis. From our perspective, it is just more evidence that the Pakistanis are either too incompetent or too complicit to be good partners."
    Markey mused there could be a potential silver lining in Osama's killing--but only "if it helps to convince Pakistan's leaders that the United States has the will, capacity, and commitment to go after its enemies and that Pakistan ought not to continue to be an active (or even passive) supporter for these groups."
    Gretchen Peters, the former ABC News bureau chief in Pakistan and author of Seeds of Terror: How Heroin Is Bankrolling the Taliban and al Qaeda, said that the current Pakistan dilemma stems from the 1980s. Back then, she explains, Pakistani security and intelligence services forged training and strategic ties with jihadi groups sent over to fight proxy wars against the Soviet forces in Afghanistan (with covert U.S. support), as well as in India in Kashmir. Those formative alliances only strengthened over time--and now, Peters notes, they're very hard for Pakistan to break.
    Abbottabad, the town where bin Laden was found, "is one of these places in Pakistan where militancy and the [Pakistani] military are in close proximity," Peters said. Indeed, she notes, it's close to other Pakistani towns that formerly housed mujahadeen and other jihadi group training camps since the '80s.
    Peters added she always expected that bin Laden would be "found in a well-guarded compound in a [Pakistani] city, not in a cave." Why? "Because it is easier to hide in places like that," she said.
    The compound where bin Laden was discovered is in a relatively new, private military development in Abbottabad, that was built in 2005.
    While U.S. officials have not publicly identified the al Qaeda courier they tracked in order to find bin Laden, the Weekly Standard's Thomas Joscelyn reported that a recently leaked U.S. military cable from the detention facility at Guantanamo Bay names an al Qaeda courier close to bin Laden--Maulawi Abd al-Khaliq Jan--who seems to fits the description provided by U.S. officials. The Associated Press reported that the courier is Kuwaiti.
    U.S. security officials said they were "shocked" at the conspicuously over-the-top security features of the sprawling compound in the affluent development when they saw it--including 12-18 foot fortification walls topped by barbed wire, a property size roughly eight times larger than others in the area, trash from the compound burnt inside rather than put on the street for collection. Particularly striking for a property they valued at a million dollars, they noted, the facility had no phone lines or Internet connections.
    But Peters said that while the specifications are perhaps more extreme, "there are lots of [thick-walled, fortified] houses like that in Pakistan. It's much easier to hide in a [newer development] community like that where the neighbors don't actually know each other than in a small village where the entire village knows each other."
    Several major al Qaeda figures have been arrested by Pakistani authorities since 9/11--including Ramzi bin al-Shibh in a Karachi apartment building, Abu Zubaydah in Faisalbad, 9/11 mastermind Khalid Shaikh Mohammad, in Rawalpindi or Quetta (depending on who you ask).
    It's that sort of cooperation that Brennan praised in his remarks Monday, while making clear the United States is not going to endlessly accept Pakistani excuses for turning a blind eye to forces within its own security structure providing support to the terrorists killing Americans. After all, Brennan notes, such forces are also killing Pakistani citizens.
    "The president feels very strongly that the people of Pakistan need to realize their potential for lives of prosperity and security," Brennan said. "And because of the militant organizations in that country, too many Pakistanis have died."

  3. #228
    Elite Member celeb_2006's Avatar
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    Default US holds photos of slain bin Laden, weighs release

    US holds photos of slain bin Laden, weighs release - Yahoo! News

    WASHINGTON Still-secret photos of the dead Osama bin Laden show a precision kill shot above his left eye, a U.S. official said, as fresh details emerged of an audacious American raid that netted potentially crucial al-Qaida records as well as the body of the global terrorist leader. President Barack Obama is going to ground zero in New York to mark the milestone and remember the dead of 9/11.

    Patience and persistence characteristics normally attributed to al-Qaida proved decisive in America's decade-long hunt for bin Laden, whose fate was sealed in 40 minutes of thunderous violence, years in the making.
    According to the U.S. account, the assault team came away with hard drives, DVDs, documents and more that might tip U.S. intelligence to al-Qaida's operational details and perhaps lead the manhunt to the presumed next-in-command, Ayman al-Zawahri.

    The administration weighed whether to release photos of bin Laden's corpse and video of his swift burial at sea. Officials were reluctant to inflame Islamic sentiment by showing graphic images of the body. But they were also eager to address the mythology already building in Pakistan and beyond that bin Laden was somehow still alive

    U.S. officials say the photographic evidence shows bin Laden was shot above his left eye, blowing away part of his skull.

    He was also shot in the chest, they said. This, near the end of a frenzied firefight in a high-walled Pakistani compound where helicopter-borne U.S. forces found 23 children, nine women, a bin Laden courier who had unwittingly led the U.S. to its target, a son of bin Laden who was also slain, and more.

  4. #229
    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by witchcurlgirl View Post

    As of this morning the White House is starting to walk back the story about whether he was armed, or used a woman as a shield, and which son was killed.
    From what I can find, it was someone else in the compound who used a woman as a human shield. And bin Laden, it appears, went down fighting - firing at commandos as they stormed his room.

    It was ordered as a kill operation, and bin Lade would have been taken alive only if he clearly surrendered.

  5. #230
    Elite Member MsChiff's Avatar
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    Just wanted to say really well said & I completely agree, Sluce. Great post. (5th post up)
    Fighting for peace is like fucking for virginity.

  6. #231
    Elite Member NVash's Avatar
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    I seem to recall reading somewhere that Osamas wife is still alive.

  7. #232
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    I first heard the news on the radio Monday morning when our alarm went off. I don't begrudge people who are celebrating his death, but I just can't because I am sobered by the fact that his was a life wasted by hatred. I know justice was served and the world is better off without Bin Laden in it, but I'm not happy about it.

  8. #233
    Elite Member sluce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NVash View Post
    I seem to recall reading somewhere that Osamas wife is still alive.
    He has many wives. I heard a report that he used one wife as a shield and then heard that Al Quada was reporting that his wife threw herself in front of him in an attempt to save him. LOL
    You don't engage with crazies. Because they're, you know, fucking crazy. - WitchCurlGirl

  9. #234
    Elite Member celeb_2006's Avatar
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    Osama bin Laden dead: President Obama's big risk pays off with raid - latimes.com

    If the raid went wrong, President Obama would bear the blame. He had vetoed a plan to obliterate the compound with an airstrike. Obama wanted to be certain he had Bin Laden, and there was no guarantee that a smoking crater would yield proof. He had asked for a bolder plan, one that would allow the U.S. to take custody of Bin Laden or his body. It posed far more risk.

    As reports flowed into the White House, the commando team methodically swept through the compound. Bin Laden and his family lived on the second and third floors of the largest structure, U.S. intelligence indicated. Officials said that when the commandos found him there, he was armed and "resisted." They shot him in the head and chest.

    There were conflicting reports Monday about whether Bin Laden had fired at the Americans, or whether he had tried to use a woman as a human shield. His wife, who called out Bin Laden's name during the fight, was wounded in the leg during the battle and may have tried to interpose herself between the troops and her husband, but Bin Laden was not hiding behind her, a senior U.S. official said.

  10. #235
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    Default Taliban express doubt that bin Laden is dead

    Taliban express doubt that bin Laden is dead - Yahoo! News

    KABUL, Afghanistan The Taliban cast suspicion Tuesday on the announcement of Osama bin Laden's death, saying they would not believe the al-Qaida leader was dead until they had seen proof or received confirmation from sources close to him.
    Though U.S. officials have said they confirmed bin Laden's identity both with face-mapping software and DNA tests, the lack of photos of the body and its burial at sea have raised doubts in Afghanistan and Pakistan that the man who evaded American detection for so long has actually been killed.
    "This news is only coming from one side, from Obama's office, and American has not shown any evidence or proof to support this claim," Taliban spokesman Zabiullah Mujahid said in a statement emailed to journalists. "On the other side, our sources close to Osama bin Laden have not confirmed or denied the news."
    "Until there is news from sources close to Osama bin Laden it will be too early to provide any reaction," the statement said.
    Afghans have reacted with emotions ranging from joy to fear that the head of al-Qaida has finally been eliminated. Some have voiced hope that this will make it easier to bring the al-Qaida-allied Taliban to the negotiating table. Others have worried that it may mean the U.S. will leave Afghanistan before the fight against the insurgency is over.
    On Monday, Afghanistan's president pointed out that the successful strike on bin Laden in Pakistan shows that he was right all along to urge Americans to focus more of their military might in the neighboring country. Karzai has repeatedly criticized international forces for putting their energy into trying to route militants from Afghan villages when the leaders of the insurgency are residing in Pakistan.
    In Kabul on Tuesday, few Afghans doubted that bin Laden was dead, but some echoed President Karzai's sentiments.
    "Osama bin Laden was found by Americans in Pakistan and poor people are getting killed by bombings in Afghanistan," said Samiullah Khan, a shopkeeper in the capital. "The government should ask when the terrorist was found in Pakistan why NATO is bombing places in Afghanistan."
    Others said they didn't expect bin Laden's death to change anything about their long-running war.
    "The situation here is not related to Osama's death," said Sayed Karim, a 50-year-old retired teacher. He argued that the Taliban's goal is to bring strict Islamic rule to the country, and any change in their relationship with al-Qaida would not alter that.
    There were, however, fears about reprisal attacks in a country where suicide bombings and roadside explosives have become commonplace. A district police commander in Kabul said that the city is on alert.
    "The Kabul city police are ready to react and stop any possible activities by al-Qaida or other enemies of this country to disturb the security," said Gen. Farooq Hassas, chief of police for Kabul's district four.
    Both U.S. officials and their Afghan counterparts have said that there is still a powerful terror network to fight in Afghanistan even after bin Laden's death and that their military strategy remains unchanged.
    And the war in Afghanistan has continued uninterrupted.
    NATO forces on Tuesday launched an airstrike against a group of private security guards who were contracted to protect military supply convoys along an eastern Afghan highway, killing one of the guards, Afghan police and the company said.
    NATO confirmed that an airstrike was called in by forces in Ghazni province, but said its initial reports suggested the strike was on "suspected insurgents."
    The international coalition said it authorized the strike after its forces observed the suspected insurgents setting up an ambush site in Gelan district activity that was confirmed by the air weapons team. They later found several machine guns, a rocket-propelled grenade and four AK-47 assault rifles.
    Afghan officials said there were no insurgents involved.
    "The Watan Risk guards came under attack on the road," said Zirawer Zahid, the Ghazni police chief. He was referring to Watan Risk Management, a private company that supplies guards for convoys, offices and international organizations.
    Zahid said the strike killed one guard. A representative for Watan confirmed that one of their guards had been killed and another five wounded when they came under attack while moving from one checkpoint on the road to another.
    "Our guards are all along this road. If we aren't here, no supply convoy can reach its destination. I don't know why the Americans targeted us," said Qudartullah Khan, who oversees Watan's operations in southeast Afghanistan. He shouted into the phone, letting go a barrage of insults at the international military coalition that contracts Watan to protect the road.
    "We are constantly under threat from militants in this area, and now the Americans are also targeting us?" he said. Five of his employees were detained by American forces, he said.
    Also Tuesday, a NATO service member was killed in a pre-dawn bomb attack in the east. There were no further details on the attack or the nationality of the deceased.
    More than 150 international service members have been killed so far this year in Afghanistan.

  11. #236
    Elite Member MsChiff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sluce View Post
    He has many wives. I heard a report that he used one wife as a shield and then heard that Al Quada was reporting that his wife threw herself in front of him in an attempt to save him. LOL
    whoa. I asked my dad last night if they killed his son & he said yeah but they left him there. eek.
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    Elite Member cupcake's Avatar
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    He was unarmed and she was shot in the leg is what they are saying. The DNA test was facemapping which generally takes a couuple of hours. Press conference going on right now
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    Elite Member celeb_2006's Avatar
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    They need to release the pictures stat. I know they will eventually, they have to since that is about the only thing left to convince the doubters. Yes even at that the doubters will still doubt it, saying it was photoshopped, etc. But still, they got no choice.

    Come on Obama, release those pics. If they're worried about inflaming tensions, well, it's not like the terrorists had stopped planning to attack the U.S. before this incident.

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    Bin Laden news finds pundits forsaking usual comfort zones | The Upshot Yahoo! News

    Meanwhile, the conservative talk-radio baron Rush Limbaugh suffered something of a tonal misfire, as some listeners took his comments on the bin Laden raid--which seem unmistakably derisive in print--as an unprecedented show of heartfelt gratitude to President Obama.


    "President Obama single-handedly came up with the technique in order to pull this off," Limbaugh said on Monday. "You see, the military wanted to go in there and bomb as they always do. They wanted to drop missiles and drop bombs and a number of totally destructive techniques here. But President Obama, perhaps the only qualified member in the room to deal with this, insisted on the Special Forces. No one else thought of that. President Obama. Not a single intelligence adviser, not a single national security adviser, not a single military adviser came up with the idea of using SEAL Team 6 or any Special Forces."

    Some members of the media didn't pick up on the joke, either. Jon Bershad of Mediaite, for instance, marveled at Limbaugh's remarks. "Limbaugh opened his show today with huge praise for his President, his military, and his country," Bershad noted. "That's right, folks. America can still get along." After some correspondents noted that Limbaugh was speaking with tongue firmly in cheek, Bershad added an update, arguing that "in the world of talk radio, everything's relative" and that the show's opening segment was "about as nice as Limbaugh's ever going to get on Obama."

    Such confusion is understandable--especially since so many of Obama's dogged pursuers were offering genuine thanks and praise to one of the most frequently lambasted figures on their broadcasts.

    "I want to personally congratulate President Obama and the men and women of the Armed Forces for a job well done," said Donald Trump, who just a week earlier was on his crusade to disprove Obama's American citizenship, in a statement to ABC News. "We should spend the next several days not debating party politics, but in remembrance of those who lost their lives on 9/11 and those currently fighting for our freedom. God Bless America!"

    Fox News host Glenn Beck also had some kind words. "First of all, congratulations to President Obama. He got him," the conservative talk show host said in response to the news of bin Laden's death. "Thank you, President Obama, thank you." And Beck's colleague on Fox, Sean Hannity, was no less fulsome in his praise, saying that Obama's leadership of the mission was "gutsy" and "the right thing to do."

    Less surprising, naturally, was the chorus of admiration offered on the left-leaning airwaves of MSNBC Monday night.

    "President Bush had 2,686 days to catch Osama bin Laden. President Obama got that job done in 831 days," said Lawrence O'Donnell ">at the start of his 8 p.m. show. "Somehow ... bin Laden got the feeling that he could settle down comfortable in a walled fortress is a Pakistan suburb. But someone -- someone -- was still thinking about bin Laden in a lethal way. ... President Obama would make his biggest national security priority getting Osama bin Laden, and so he did."

  15. #240
    Elite Member bellini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by celeb_2006 View Post
    They need to release the pictures stat. I know they will eventually, they have to since that is about the only thing left to convince the doubters. Yes even at that the doubters will still doubt it, saying it was photoshopped, etc. But still, they got no choice.

    Come on Obama, release those pics. If they're worried about inflaming tensions, well, it's not like the terrorists had stopped planning to attack the U.S. before this incident.
    I heard this morning that he was shot in the face. His skull blew apart. So how would anyone be able to tell it was him? If that's the case, where he's unrecognizable, there will be doubters for sure.


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