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Thread: LGBT protesters annoy Barack Obama during speech by calling for equality. Boo hoo.

  1. #16
    Friend of Gossip Rocks! buttmunch's Avatar
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    ^^Exactly. And Grimm, do you propose that DADT is more important than sorting out the economic mess and assorted other issues being dealt with. I'm not saying it's an either/or situation but I don't see it as being a priority. If it could be changed with an executive order then great, do it. But since it can't and, as I said, something like this is going to take a great deal of hand holding I think you should keep it in your pants and see what happens. I'm happy to see people pushing the issue and it will help things along but I also think people expect everything to happen overnight, in one fell swoop. It doesn't work that way in politics.
    Last edited by buttmunch; April 21st, 2010 at 06:14 AM.
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  2. #17
    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by visitor42 View Post
    No, he can't. DADT is already in the law, and would require an act of Congress to change it.

    More On ‘Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell’ And Executive Orders - Law Blog - WSJ
    I didn't say he could change the law, I said he could suspend the discharges:

    In May 2009, a committee of military law experts at the University of California at Santa Barbara concluded that, while "Legislative action is still required to permanently remove 'don’t ask, don’t tell', the President can issue an Executive Order to suspend discharges.

    http://www.palmcenter.org/files/acti...0-%20final.pdf


    Ending “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell”
    http://www.americanprogress.org/issu...6/pdf/dadt.pdf



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  3. #18
    Friend of Gossip Rocks! buttmunch's Avatar
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    I've been re-reading through this thread and I agree that maybe, just maybe Obama could do more and, as a confirmed fag hag, I wish he would. But I think I'm a pretty pragmatic person myself so see his actions--or non-actions--as the actions of a man taking on what he can at this time. Maybe I'm the one who's naive. I guess I don't expect everything to happen overnight and know that it's damned tough to get anything controversial through Congress in the best of times...and we are not going through the best of times, politicly.
    'Those who sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither.' Ben Franklin

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  4. #19
    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by buttmunch View Post
    Maybe I'm the one who's naive.

    I think good hearted is probably a better way to describe you. You look for the positive.



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  5. #20
    Elite Member Sundance's Avatar
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    What's so frustrating for me is that it's just a basic human rights issue. It shouldn't be this hard. It makes me so mad that people have to keep being pushed back into the closet & denied the same rights everyone else enjoys. They're not only denied rights, they're penalized. I can only imagine how difficult it must be to be treated as if you're less than human by your own government.
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  6. #21
    Friend of Gossip Rocks! buttmunch's Avatar
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    I wish Clinton would weigh in on this since it came into play under his watch.

    And thanks, witchy!
    'Those who sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither.' Ben Franklin

    "When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying the cross."
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  7. #22
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    He can SUSPEND discharges with a stop loss executive order until the law is changed. That is reality.

    Also, it's not the best of times? The Dems have a supermajority in both houses, DADT repeal is at 70% approval rating (funny, the same it was for the public option in health "reform", but we know how that turned out), and people want the situation to somehow become better??

    There will never be a better time, politically. What else is needed? Does jesus himself have to come down and order it?

    What's needed is LEADERSHIP and political courage, something this administration is sorely lacking.

    Anyhow, another article for your enlightenment:

    Pressure is building among some allies on Capitol Hill to repeal Don't Ask Don't Tell "this year." But, there's push back for that approach coming from the White House according to the Denver Post:


    The White House is facing a budding revolt over its carefully crafted strategy for repeal of the ban on gays serving openly in the military that would have pushed the decision past the November election.


    The article notes the efforts of two members of the Colorado delegation, Senator Mark Udall and Rep. Jared Polis, who are working to get the law repealed this year:


    Democrats in the House and Senate — including two key lawmakers from Colorado — say they are unwilling to wait for completion of a 10-month Pentagon study on repeal of the policy known as "don't ask, don't tell" and are instead moving to include immediate repeal in the defense reauthorization bill, scheduled for mark-up next month.

    Sen. Mark Udall, D-Colo., among the Democrats on the Senate Armed Services Committee backing the move, said the committee was "within a vote or two" of including repeal in the must- pass legislation. He met with three discharged members of the military Tuesday, using their stories to highlight the need for repeal this year.

    Rep. Jared Polis, a Boulder Democrat and one of three openly gay members of Congress, holds a key position on the Rules Committee that he is willing to use to insert a similar provision in the House version of the spending bill, he said Tuesday.

    Congressional aides said both approaches are likely to face opposition from the White House, which in February laid a timetable built around an extensive Pentagon study that won't be completed until Dec. 1, pushing a final move on the contentious issue past what's expected to be Democrats' toughest election cycle in years.



    This is one of the most succinct explanations of what's currently happening on DADT I've seen. And, it confirms what we've been hearing and reporting. Also, it's amazing to read that our "opposition" to our civil rights, to the President's own promise, will likely come from the White House.

    Let's review: In the State of the Union, the President promised to repeal DADT "this year." He was very clear about it, even said "this year" twice. Since then, every indication we've gotten, both publicly and privately, is that repeal won't be happening this year. If Democrats suffer serious losses in November, which many pundits are predicting, it's going to be much harder, if not impossible, to get DADT repealed in 2011 -- or for years to come.

    For some reason, the White House staff working on DADT repeal, led by Deputy Chief of Staff Jim Messina, aren't following through on the promise of their boss. I suspect that craven political team at the White House is making a calculation that it's politically easier for them not to do repeal this year. If so, big mistake. Obama made the promise. He has to deliver. If not, Team Obama (and the Democratic party) will be starting the reelection campaign with a big gay problem.

    All we are asking is for the President to keep his promise.

    AMERICAblog Gay: Denver Post: 'White House is facing a budding revolt' over its DADT strategy
    Last edited by Grimmlok; April 21st, 2010 at 09:34 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by buttmunch View Post
    I've been re-reading through this thread and I agree that maybe, just maybe Obama could do more and, as a confirmed fag hag, I wish he would. But I think I'm a pretty pragmatic person myself so see his actions--or non-actions--as the actions of a man taking on what he can at this time. Maybe I'm the one who's naive. I guess I don't expect everything to happen overnight and know that it's damned tough to get anything controversial through Congress in the best of times...and we are not going through the best of times, politicly.
    I agree with you.
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  9. #24
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    YEah, you already have all your rights. It's easy for you to sit and say "wait", to paternalistically think you can set the timetable for the freedom of others. You have nothing on the line. Gays have been waiting forever, and if they listened to you they would remain waiting forever for that magical time when there was nothing else going on, all other problems were solved, and 100% of the public was behind it.

    Again, I will repeat: this IS the best time politically. supermajorities in both houses. 70% public approval rating.

    IT WILL NOT GET ANY BETTER THAN THIS. Realize that.
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  10. #25
    Elite Member sputnik's Avatar
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    ^^^
    that's very true.
    i don't know why democrats are losing time trying to be 'bipartisan' and include the republicans. they've got majorities. they just need to get shit done and pass bills before the next elections when things might (and probably will) change and they'll have to deal with a lot more republicans in both congress and senate.
    dumbasses.

    at the same time, i think they're also having trouble convincing a lot of their own people - since there are dems who are basically republicans in sheep's clothing. you compare a democrat from the northeast with, say, a democrat from the bible belt, and it's a different species altogether.
    I'm open to everything. When you start to criticise the times you live in, your time is over. - Karl Lagerfeld

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