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Thread: Historians rank Abe Lincoln best president, George W. Bush seventh worst president

  1. #16
    Elite Member Sweetie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nana55 View Post
    Lincoln wanted to send the blacks back to Africa or another country because he felt even if they had their freedom here, they would never be accepted. Yes he held some racist views but was always, always against slavery and the treatment given blacks. He also did change his ideas as he got older and had more real life experiences.
    You work in a library, pick up a book sometime.
    You might find a bit of knowledge if you do.



    Also, Lincoln did nothing to abolish slavery in the states that the government (he) controlled. He only abolished it in the states that he didn't control at the time.

    He's also been quoted as saying:

    "I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in anyway the social and political equality of the white and black races - that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race."..........September 18th, 1858

    "No amendment shall be made to the Constitution which will authorize or give to Congress the power to abolish or interfere, within any State, with the domestic institutions thereof, including that of persons held to labor or service by the laws of said State.".... Joint Resolution of Congress, Adopted March 2, 1861

    "I declare that I have no intention, directly or indirectly, to interfere with slavery in the states where it exists."........Inaugural address March 1861

    "My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it......" August 22nd, 1862.

  2. #17
    Elite Member NicoleWasHere's Avatar
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    Who really cares what kind of a guy Lincoln was? The son of a bitch's been DEAD for two hundred years. He was a product of his time, and was still a decent president as a result. Move on, already.

  3. #18
    Elite Member Sweetie's Avatar
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    Nicole, if you don't like it you move on. I will comment on whatever, for as long as I want to.

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    Elite Member NicoleWasHere's Avatar
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    I'm not the one who was making a big deal of it for two pages.

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    Elite Member Sweetie's Avatar
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    I didn't say you were, now did I?

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    Elite Member louiswinthorpe111's Avatar
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    Lincoln's basic stance of slavery in the beginning was not necessarily to abolish it, but to preserve the union. If he could have done it without freeing a slave, he would have done it. Lincoln was mostly against the expansionism of slavery into new states, particularly Kansas and Nebraska territory. He, as many in his time, were going to let slavery go until it imploded on itself, which it eventually would have. But his reflections later in his Presidency change his stance on that.

    I think if Lincoln was also properly able to carry out some reconstruction plans for blacks after the war, things would have been a lot different. Andrew Johnson didn't really give a shit.

    Reagan gets "credit" for ending the cold war. I,as many other historians, think Reagan was just in the right place at the right time. A comparison between slavery and communism can be made here. Communism imploded on itself, just as many thought slavery would have.

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    I take lists like this with a grain of salt. While Lincoln and Washington may have indeed been good presidents, so many of our opinions of past leaders are based on the mythology passed down to us from teachers and parents. We're not taught the full truth of our history and have to research it ourselves to get a complete answer. That answer tends to be complicated and not easily addressed by over-simplified popularity polls.

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    Elite Member bychance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valley Doll View Post
    I take lists like this with a grain of salt. While Lincoln and Washington may have indeed been good presidents, so many of our opinions of past leaders are based on the mythology passed down to us from teachers and parents. We're not taught the full truth of our history and have to research it ourselves to get a complete answer. That answer tends to be complicated and not easily addressed by over-simplified popularity polls.
    Very much so.

  9. #24
    Elite Member kingcap72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by louiswinthorpe111 View Post
    Lincoln's basic stance of slavery in the beginning was not necessarily to abolish it, but to preserve the union. If he could have done it without freeing a slave, he would have done it. Lincoln was mostly against the expansionism of slavery into new states, particularly Kansas and Nebraska territory. He, as many in his time, were going to let slavery go until it imploded on itself, which it eventually would have. But his reflections later in his Presidency change his stance on that.

    I think if Lincoln was also properly able to carry out some reconstruction plans for blacks after the war, things would have been a lot different. Andrew Johnson didn't really give a shit.

    Reagan gets "credit" for ending the cold war. I,as many other historians, think Reagan was just in the right place at the right time. A comparison between slavery and communism can be made here. Communism imploded on itself, just as many thought slavery would have.
    Exactly. Lincoln only freed the slaves to save the Union, not because he was against the idea of slavery. But I still say he has to be given credit for keeping the country from imploding during the Civil War, no matter what his personal views were. Because if he hadn't we would be living in a very different America today.

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