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Thread: Hispanic growth moving eastward

  1. #16
    Elite Member KrisNine's Avatar
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    Well, I certainly am not afraid of other cultures or races or whatever. I was just saying that the changing face of America is interesting. It should be a non-issue, but I have a feeling it's never going to be that easy.

  2. #17
    Elite Member darksithbunny's Avatar
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    It just be raining hispanics on the eastcoast! I figured it was just the high cost of living that everyone is forced to move where they can afford it. Or at least where the jobs are.

  3. #18
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    Elite Member crumpet's Avatar
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    I don't know how these people know that fear is the reason for moving.

  5. #20
    Hit By Ban Bus! AliceInWonderland's Avatar
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    thats funny latinaforever!

  6. #21
    Elite Member ManxMouse's Avatar
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    Look, just talking about illegal immigration now, I don't see why Americans are just expected to suck it up and get over it. The problem is that in many areas, the work that is done by the immigrants (which they are paid for without being taxed, unless they are hired with stolen social security numbers) is far outweighed by the demand put on public services.

    Do you think that the construction work, house cleaning, restaurant work etc. -- the jobs that Americans won't do, we are told --is equal to putting all of the illegal worker's kids through public school (with even more resources to try to teach English so they can catch up while trying to give Spanish instruction at the same time), the health care and emergency services provided since they are uninsured and get free care, and all other services & benefits that taxed citizens and residents receive? Particularly in border areas, the collapse of the health care system and near-bankruptcy of hospitals and clinics is a very real problem. Unfortunately, to point this out these days brands someone a silly, backwards American at best, and a racist at worst.

    We just need a better system. If we are going to give up on stopping the flow of thousands daily into the country, we should at least try to figure out WHO is here, and tax their wages appropriately....just like all the rest of us who have to pay taxes to support the infrastructure.

  7. #22
    Elite Member JamieElizabeth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ManxMouse View Post
    We just need a better system. If we are going to give up on stopping the flow of thousands daily into the country, we should at least try to figure out WHO is here, and tax their wages appropriately....just like all the rest of us who have to pay taxes to support the infrastructure.
    We should have a better infrastructure, for sure.
    It's like this country has tried to speed up on development, including the housing industry that it's never had time to adjust to any of it.

  8. #23
    Hit By Ban Bus! AliceInWonderland's Avatar
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    well something could have been done a couple of months ago in congress! but guess what? the motion(s) were shot down and nothing was done. so now, instead of something, we have the borders still a massive wide-open joke and more ppl coming here illegally so that whenever something is done, its only going to cost us more and more money to either kick these ppl out or include them in the mix. its ridiculous! more is lost to indecision than decision and our congress failed us all legal and illegal taxpayer and non-taxpayer once again!

  9. #24
    Elite Member Sojiita's Avatar
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    I am very much for diversity..but I do wish some groups would do a little more to assimilate a bit more into the larger culture-like at least attempting to learn English, be legal(if possible), pay taxes, etc etc. The area I am currently moving out of is becoming increasingly Hispanic, with alot of Somalis and Asians as well. Kind of neat with all of the ethnic stores and restaurants opening up all over. Too bad that a rather large portion of the population(of all types, races etc.) is CRIMINAL TRASH I will miss the diversity and the liveliness of this neighborhood when out in the rural boondocks surrounded by all white people..but I will NOT miss the increasing crime and physical deterioration of this neighborhood. 3 murders recently.


    It does seem like the hispanic element does seem particularly prone to violence given the amount of gun violence and the actual numbers of hispanics. I don't know if this is related to the pressures of being recent immigrants in a new area, facing discrimination and marginalization, or is a reflection more of the type of people who are actually emigrating for whatever reason. Hope that does not sound racist-not meant to be-just an observation. It does seem like most of the violence is within their group-maybe it is gang related and is just a continuation of what was happening elsewhere?

    *also love how the latinos here seem to have a penchant for drinking and then getting behind the wheel(just a gross generalization I know..lol)..but at least we have something in common! LOl..(now now I quit doing that..but I have the history of it..) And I can say this having been hit by a latino(my car was parked) who had no insurance and was drunk as a skunk! lol

    *Probably good thing I am getting out and moving to trailerville. If I stayed here they would probably assimiliate me and I would all of a sudden find myself straight and speaking Spanish while trying to hide the bottle of tequila from the officer who had just pulled my swerving vehicle over! hehehe. ...

    On the other hand..I could also be assimilated in trailerville and end up slurring some redneck-speak to the officer who pulled me over while trying to shush my 19 year old girfriend and the 4 kids in the back of the junker while trying to hide the 24 pack of Old Milwaukee!!!! yikes I am doomed either way! LOL
    Last edited by Sojiita; August 12th, 2007 at 07:12 AM.
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  10. #25
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    I believe it is generational, this dislike for change. If you go back through American history, the hate towards ethnic groups has been absolutely shameful. Less than a 100 years ago, we had the Japanese in internment camps, the Chinese were also discriminated against horribly and now the Latinos. The arguments have been used time and time again against any ethnic group that is seen as a threat. They are here to take our jobs, they are a burden to society, they are criminals, they refuse to assimilate, and so on. Those are the arguments that have been used against minorities for hundreds of years. No ethnic group, English, Irish, Germans, etc.., has ever been immune from this. Read into our American history, you will see these patterns, verbatim, have been used against everyone. Nothing new here.

  11. #26
    Gold Member latinaforever's Avatar
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    of course-there are criminals within all races-but the majority of this people are just trying to give their children an opportunity for a better life than their parents. it's too late for the "deportation" argument-they are here-and those kids are growing and if they are denied education and health care you are looking at a time bomb.

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  12. #27
    Elite Member Palermo's Avatar
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    Living in CA I have seen firsthand just how hard Mexicans work. "They" can talk all they want to about how they are taking jobs away from people but the Mexicans do all the backbreaking work in the boiling heat without complaint. They work for less money. I would like to see how a group of us would cope bent double in a field all day, my guess is in a few hours we'd all be laid out somewhere, we couldn't do it. I have nothing but the utmost respect for their work ethic. I recently read an article with personal stories about how people got in over their heads with mortages they never should have gotten and all groups except the Hispanic one just said screw it and waited to be thrown out. The Hispanic family all went out and got a second or third job and tried valiantly to keep their home.

  13. #28
    Elite Member nana55's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by A*O View Post
    Race = "foreigners" = race

    I don't understand why there is so much suspicion towards certain ethnic groups in America, especially latinos. I know there's a huge problem with illegal immigrants but these people are the backbone of the service industries and I'm sure people would soon start to whine if there wasn't anyone around to, literally, do their dirty work for them.

    Of course we have illegal immigrants here too, but being an island, albeit a BIG one, getting in and out of Australia illegally is a lot more difficult. We also have a policy of either instantly deporting, ie on the next plane, people trying to get in on false papers, etc OR they are put into a detention centre while their status is determined. Some do slip under the radar - usually by over-staying their legal tourist visa - but it's nowhere near on the scale of the US or UK.

    There is nothing wrong with cultural diversity in a community - in fact I think it should be actively encouraged so the remaining racist bigots get to find out first hand that there is no 'threat' at all. The alternative is the ghetto mentality which only perpetuates the mutual suspicion and hatred between racial/religious/cultural groups. I'm afraid that there are some parts of America where people are so cocooned in their complacent comfort-zone that ANY kind of 'outsider' is instantly perceived as a Bad Thing.
    No one understands the problem until they spend a few months or years in the situation. I live in San Diego, right next to the border. I know our ecomony depends on the Hispanic. It shouldn't. When I'm in Canada they have white people working in restaurant, (at least in Winnipeg) and they are paid a decent wage. That is why we hire the Mexican, because we are too damn cheap to pay a decent wage. I grant you you will never get the "white boys" to pick fruit, we never have been able too, but you won't get second and third generation hispanics to do it either. The Mexican culture has a lot of really wonderful aspects to it and I think we embrace a lot of them. However the illegals who go to our schools, use our emergency rooms, and insist on speaking only Spanish do not add to our culture. California has changed and a lot of it not for the good. I really doubt if we went to Mexico in huge numbers and started to change their culture they would be pleased. They love their culture and that is great. So do Asians, and they keep their culture and share it. However I don't feel that is pervades my everyday life and schools. I have worked in schools for 25 years, I have seen a real change. The street works both ways. We need to help them learn english so they can advance, and they need to try and accept this as their country. Nothing irks me more when a second or third generation says they are Mexican and believe me they do, all the time. Most of them only go down there to shop if they go at all. No other culture refuses to assimilate like the hispanic.
    If I can't be a good example, then let me be a horrible warning.

  14. #29
    Elite Member nana55's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sojiita View Post
    I am very much for diversity..but I do wish some groups would do a little more to assimilate a bit more into the larger culture-like at least attempting to learn English, be legal(if possible), pay taxes, etc etc. The area I am currently moving out of is becoming increasingly Hispanic, with alot of Somalis and Asians as well. Kind of neat with all of the ethnic stores and restaurants opening up all over. Too bad that a rather large portion of the population(of all types, races etc.) is CRIMINAL TRASH I will miss the diversity and the liveliness of this neighborhood when out in the rural boondocks surrounded by all white people..but I will NOT miss the increasing crime and physical deterioration of this neighborhood. 3 murders recently.


    It does seem like the hispanic element does seem particularly prone to violence given the amount of gun violence and the actual numbers of hispanics. I don't know if this is related to the pressures of being recent immigrants in a new area, facing discrimination and marginalization, or is a reflection more of the type of people who are actually emigrating for whatever reason. Hope that does not sound racist-not meant to be-just an observation. It does seem like most of the violence is within their group-maybe it is gang related and is just a continuation of what was happening elsewhere?

    *also love how the latinos here seem to have a penchant for drinking and then getting behind the wheel(just a gross generalization I know..lol)..but at least we have something in common! LOl..(now now I quit doing that..but I have the history of it..) And I can say this having been hit by a latino(my car was parked) who had no insurance and was drunk as a skunk! lol

    *Probably good thing I am getting out and moving to trailerville. If I stayed here they would probably assimiliate me and I would all of a sudden find myself straight and speaking Spanish while trying to hide the bottle of tequila from the officer who had just pulled my swerving vehicle over! hehehe. ...

    On the other hand..I could also be assimilated in trailerville and end up slurring some redneck-speak to the officer who pulled me over while trying to shush my 19 year old girfriend and the 4 kids in the back of the junker while trying to hide the 24 pack of Old Milwaukee!!!! yikes I am doomed either way! LOL
    No one argues that the immigrants bust their ass. However their children and second generation, not so much. I know I work in a california elementary school and have for 25 years. They insist they are Mexican even if born here, even if they have never been to Mexico. How can they become American with that attitude. Of course no one wants to pick fruit and only desperate people do it. It has always been like that. Even decent wages won't change that. However decent wages will prevent the huge influx we get. Most are not coming to pick fruit, at least not for very long. Mexican are in all types of jobs, the hotel and food industry is almost exclusivly Hispanic......why, because they pay them under the table, or shit wages with no benefits. They will live 2 to 3 to a house. Why would we be proud of that. Pay a decent wage and you will get busboys who speack English, maids who speak English etc. "In and Out" pays $11.00 an hour. They have no trouble getting employees and manage to make a tidy profit. Restaurant and hotels just want such a big fucking profit they pay crap to their employees. Pay a good wage and you will have your pick. I worked as a busboy and maid and I learned a lot. I wouldn't do it now, they pay such crap wages, not even minimum wage. If your hispanic, you don't dare complain, they'll turn you in. The gangs are another huge problem. My husband who was a huge Hispanic supporter opened his business in a heavily Latino area, he has changed his mind now.
    If I can't be a good example, then let me be a horrible warning.

  15. #30
    A*O
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    The unwillingness to assimilate does seem be be a large part of the problem. Melbourne has a very large Vietnamese community who arrived as refugees in the aftermath of the war there and most of them are here legally. Ditto our Lebanese and former Yugoslavian communities. Of course there are some religious and racial tensions but generally speaking everyone gets along OK and people certainly don't harbour this deep resentment towards them, probably because they are here as Australian citizens and with a few exceptions they do embrace the Australian way of life and culture while still keeping their own traditions. If there is any unwillingness to assimilate it's usually along religious lines: no prizes for guessing which, but that's another discussion.

    As for crime, we do have gangs (usually Asian) but they tend to fight among themselves and it's all about drugs of course. But it's nowhere near on the same scale as in some parts of the US and our gun control laws are helpful too (their weapon of choice is usually a fucking great machete!).

    I admit I am a little confused how illegal immigrant kids can openly use the school and medical systems in the US without their parents being busted and deported.
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