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Thread: Elisabeth Hasselbeck defends Sarah Palin's hunting by bringing up abortion

  1. #46
    Elite Member Honey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by western View Post

    Unless abortions are being done by a doctor shooting at women from an airplane I really don't see what one has to do with the other.
    What an image

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by southernbelle View Post
    With the many, many contraceptive options available to women in the US, including the morning after pill, I don't think there's any excuse for failing to take advantage of those and then expecting an abortion on demand when you get pregnant.
    Since we both live in Texas, I think it's important to note that Catholic Hospitals in particular will not provide the morning after pill(imagine some of the rural areas in Texas with access to NOTHING--probably not even a fresh pack of condoms that aren't from 1999).

    With regard to your meaningful discussion about casual sex, I am in strong agreement with you (especially the older I get). I see so many young women (including me up to age 30) careless with sex partners and I just happened to get lucky and dodge the disease/pregnancy bullets. I'm not advocating abstinence but there must be a middle ground that we can remember sex should be about love (lust is hot but fleeting). Wouldn't everyone rather be more selective with sex partners and find those rare few who you really care about rather than just hopping into bed because the person sets your genitals aflame (since explosive sex means transcendence when meaningful love is there)?

  3. #48
    Elite Member nana55's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ConstanceSpry View Post
    That's exactly how most pro-choice people I know, including myself, think. I would support abortion in each and every case, I don't care what the reasoning is. If a woman does not want to carry out a pregnancy, no one should be able to force her. Even if she uses abortion as birth control, it's her body and no one elses' business. And certainly preferable to popping out unwanted infants tax payers will have to support.
    Excuse me!! Have you any children. Do you feel you have no responsability to use birth control? If you are in your eight month and decide this having a baby is too difficult you believe in abortion. I'm not talking medical reason. Have any of you heard of ADOPTION? To actually say it is no ones business is appaling. Abortion is a choice most women make very reluctantly, it is NOT birth control. I can't believe someone would actually write this.
    If I can't be a good example, then let me be a horrible warning.

  4. #49
    Elite Member southernbelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nana55 View Post
    Excuse me!! Have you any children. Do you feel you have no responsability to use birth control? If you are in your eight month and decide this having a baby is too difficult you believe in abortion. I'm not talking medical reason. Have any of you heard of ADOPTION? To actually say it is no ones business is appaling. Abortion is a choice most women make very reluctantly, it is NOT birth control. I can't believe someone would actually write this.
    I agree.

  5. #50
    Elite Member ConstanceSpry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nana55 View Post
    Excuse me!! Have you any children. Do you feel you have no responsability to use birth control? If you are in your eight month and decide this having a baby is too difficult you believe in abortion. I'm not talking medical reason. Have any of you heard of ADOPTION? To actually say it is no ones business is appaling. Abortion is a choice most women make very reluctantly, it is NOT birth control. I can't believe someone would actually write this.
    Sorry, but as long as abortion is legal, it IS no one else's business, just the business of the woman who is pregnant. And as for how late into a pregnancy abortion is legal, I leave that to individual state laws. If they say it's legal at 8 months, then I guess it's legal.

    Just to clarify my comment about abortion as birth control, I am NOT suggesting women should use abortion as birth control, but I am saying that EVEN IF a woman were to use abortion as birth control, it is her business and preferable to birthing unwanted infants.

    And most women I know who've had abortions have not had them reluctantly. Not everyone wants children and not everyone gets pregnant due to not using birth control. People do get pregnant after using precaution. Do you really suggest every woman who accidentally gets pregnant should carry out the pregnancy and then give the infant up for adoption? Now THAT is preposterous!!

    And since you asked, though this is irrelevant to this discussion, my husband had a vasectomy years ago and thankfully I have not had to worry about birth control.

  6. #51
    Elite Member Penny Lane's Avatar
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    The fact still remains that premarital sex is as much of a sin against the catechism as employing the use of contraceptives and--if it comes to it-- having an abortion. I just don't agree with cherrypicking religious tenets... it's all or nothing if you want to play that game.

    "Fornication is carnal union between an unmarried man and an unmarried woman. It is gravely contrary to the dignity of persons and of human sexuality which is naturally ordered to the good of spouses and the generation and education of children. Moreover, it is a grave scandal when there is corruption of the young."


    "Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body." - 1 Corinthians 6:18


    "But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks. For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God." - Ephesians 5:3-5

  7. #52
    Elite Member ConstanceSpry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Penny Lane View Post
    The fact still remains that premarital sex is as much of a sin against the catechism as employing the use of contraceptives and--if it comes to it-- having an abortion. I just don't agree with cherrypicking religious tenets... it's all or nothing if you want to play that game.
    All the christians I know are Cafeteria Christians, picking and choosing which part of the bible suits them, and rejecting the rest.

  8. #53
    Elite Member Penny Lane's Avatar
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    Convenience catholics is what I call them. Abortion is a woman's choice, IMO. You don't let the pope crawl up your cooter so don't crawl up mine if I make the decision to terminate a pregnancy. I deal with the consequences--emotional and physical-- of my decision... I don't need a structured, corrupt system of beliefs masquerading as a church to tell me otherwise, ESPECIALLY if I'm only going to pick and choose which tenets I abide by and which tenets I consider extraneous.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ConstanceSpry View Post
    Sorry, but as long as abortion is legal, it IS no one else's business, just the business of the woman who is pregnant. And as for how late into a pregnancy abortion is legal, I leave that to individual state laws. If they say it's legal at 8 months, then I guess it's legal.

    Just to clarify my comment about abortion as birth control, I am NOT suggesting women should use abortion as birth control, but I am saying that EVEN IF a woman were to use abortion as birth control, it is her business and preferable to birthing unwanted infants.

    And most women I know who've had abortions have not had them reluctantly. Not everyone wants children and not everyone gets pregnant due to not using birth control. People do get pregnant after using precaution. Do you really suggest every woman who accidentally gets pregnant should carry out the pregnancy and then give the infant up for adoption? Now THAT is preposterous!!

    And since you asked, though this is irrelevant to this discussion, my husband had a vasectomy years ago and thankfully I have not had to worry about birth control.
    I agree with everything you said here. It is no ones business except for the woman carrying the clump of cells.

    Quote Originally Posted by ConstanceSpry View Post
    All the christians I know are Cafeteria Christians, picking and choosing which part of the bible suits them, and rejecting the rest.
    They're always the ones that preach the loudest. Do as I say not as I do. Don't open your mouth unless you follow your religion 100%, and even then I don't want to hear it.
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  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by southernbelle View Post

    As far as people getting pregnant because they have partners who "refuse to wear condoms," I would hope they'd have enough self respect and intelligence not to sleep with that person, especially if they didn't want a kid. If it's a situation of actual rape, that's different, but willingly having sex with a partner who won't wear a condom if you're not using any other form of contraception and you don't want a kid is extremely poor judgment, IMO.
    i agree. yes, ideally, it would be great if we lived in a world where women had enough self-respect to never sleep with a loser who refuses to wear a condom, and yes, doing so is poor judgement, especially if they're not using any other form of contraception. the world is full of dumbasses. but is punish these women's poor judgement by forcing them to go through with a pregnancy really worth it? a lot of conservatives go on about how if you're not prepared to have a baby, you shouldn't have sex. and that if you do and get knocked up you should face the consequences. but what they're forgetting is that it's the kid who will reall be getting screwed over. if they cared so much about babies, they'd care about the kind of lives they are going to have too, not just saving them from evil abortions. let's face it, most of them will either abort or keep the kid, few will give it up for adoption.

    and really, do you think these women should be having kids? i don't. and honestly, i'd just rather be pragmatic about it. i'd rather they have an abortion than bring yet another unwanted child into the world that they will probably be a horrible parent to.
    I'm open to everything. When you start to criticise the times you live in, your time is over. - Karl Lagerfeld

  11. #56
    Elite Member nana55's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ConstanceSpry View Post
    Sorry, but as long as abortion is legal, it IS no one else's business, just the business of the woman who is pregnant. And as for how late into a pregnancy abortion is legal, I leave that to individual state laws. If they say it's legal at 8 months, then I guess it's legal.

    Just to clarify my comment about abortion as birth control, I am NOT suggesting women should use abortion as birth control, but I am saying that EVEN IF a woman were to use abortion as birth control, it is her business and preferable to birthing unwanted infants.

    And most women I know who've had abortions have not had them reluctantly. Not everyone wants children and not everyone gets pregnant due to not using birth control. People do get pregnant after using precaution. Do you really suggest every woman who accidentally gets pregnant should carry out the pregnancy and then give the infant up for adoption? Now THAT is preposterous!!

    And since you asked, though this is irrelevant to this discussion, my husband had a vasectomy years ago and thankfully I have not had to worry about birth control.
    Of course I don't think every woman should be forced to give birth. But with pregnancy tests letting you know so soon, there is no reason to wait until you are so far along you can feel the baby kick. I didn't ask if you used birth control, I asked if you had any children. My husband also had a vasectomy 2 weeks after our second was born because we were done and we were responsible.
    If I can't be a good example, then let me be a horrible warning.

  12. #57
    Elite Member nana55's Avatar
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    I also think if a woman waits too long she should have to either keep the baby or ideally give it up for adoption. I am an atheist so it has nothing to do with religion. For the first 3 months I'm whatever you want to do I don't care. Once you are heading into the fourth month I have a problem with having an abortion "for any reason". Sickness, deformed fetus O.K. but because you can't be bothered raising a kid, too bad, so sad, too late. Give it up!
    If I can't be a good example, then let me be a horrible warning.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sputnik View Post
    i agree. yes, ideally, it would be great if we lived in a world where women had enough self-respect to never sleep with a loser who refuses to wear a condom, and yes, doing so is poor judgement, especially if they're not using any other form of contraception. the world is full of dumbasses. but is punish these women's poor judgement by forcing them to go through with a pregnancy really worth it? a lot of conservatives go on about how if you're not prepared to have a baby, you shouldn't have sex. and that if you do and get knocked up you should face the consequences. but what they're forgetting is that it's the kid who will reall be getting screwed over. if they cared so much about babies, they'd care about the kind of lives they are going to have too, not just saving them from evil abortions. let's face it, most of them will either abort or keep the kid, few will give it up for adoption.
    The only ones that would really have to face the consequences of premarital sex are the woman.
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  14. #59
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    Women are the ones that have to face the consequences of marital sex, too. Until the time babies grow in jars or start calling "Daddy" in the middle of the night instead of "Mommy".

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    ^True. That's is why it pisses me off when you have men trying to tell woman what they can't or can do with their bodies.
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