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Thread: Is this the beginning of the end of America?

  1. #31
    Elite Member cynic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greysfang View Post
    It doesn't matter if inflation was only 0.3% last year. Tell me what was inflation for a 20 year trend, then talk to me about how prices haven't gone up.
    ...from "A History of Money From Ancient Times to the Present Day" by Glyn Davies.....

    Changes in the Value of Money over time

    Historical Background

    A frequent question is "how much would a specified amount of money at a certain period of time be worth today?" The sources listed below are useful in attempting to answer this question. Comparisons of purchasing power are only reliable over short periods. A typical computer in 2006 is a very different machine from its counterpart of 5 years ago. Indices of inflation fail to take proper account of improvements in quality.
    Even in the essentials of life there are significant changes over the years. A typical diet in most advanced countries will be rather different today from what it would have been before the refrigerator became a common household item.
    Furthermore it has been argued that anthropometric measures of well-being, e.g. people's height, are a far better measure of a nation's standard of living than such conventional indicators as gross national product or per capita income.
    Therefore over long time spans, changes in prices give only the very roughest and most approximate idea of changes in the value of money.


    Quote Originally Posted by eeyore0101 View Post
    But then wouldn't the fact that it takes two people to now work to afford what one could afford before prove the point of huge housing market price jumps?

    Plus 2 average salaries these days don't buy much house either. Especially not NY/NJ area.
    ....most women did not enter the workforce because they had to, but because women's liberation "allowed" them to......and as I stated above...the housing market in the U.S. is hugely different from state to state.....

  2. #32
    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eeyore0101 View Post
    But then wouldn't the fact that it takes two people to now work to afford what one could afford before prove the point of huge housing market price jumps?

    Plus 2 average salaries these days don't buy much house either. Especially not NY/NJ area.
    I don't know. There was a story about a year ago in either the Washington Post or USA Today saying that the size of the average home had increased something like 50% in size over the last 20 years. Comparing on the basis of square footage.

    If you were trying to buy a house during the end of the Carter era, it was just brutal. I think that mortgage rates had hit as least 15% and continued to go even higher into the first couple of years of the Reagan administration.

    It is very hard to make a comparison because of all the factors at stake. Technology has never been more affordable. A tv with a 25" color screen back in the 1970's would have set you back at least $500-700. Now, you can get a 46" plasma TV with twice the resolution. Supposedly, the cost of cars have been fairly even relative to salary. College education has never been LESS affordable than now.

  3. #33
    Elite Member cynic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBDSP View Post
    The CPI strips out food and energy prices. It does not accurately reflect the hit that people are taking in their pocket books.

    When I read your quote, I knew that when I checked the article that I would find that food and energy prices weren't included. I am not an economist and I don't know if this stat is intentionally used for obfuscation, but I am a woman who buys groceries for my family and I know where our money goes.

    PS. My daughter got accepted to college today. The college she was accepted to costs 5 times as much as the college I went to--a very good one--30 years ago. Yet, my husband and I together make just about 10-15% more than my father made on his own 30 years ago. Yes, 30 years ago. Yeah, let's see how we swing that.

    Consumer Price Index Summary

    FOR TECHNICAL INFORMATION: Stephen B. Reed (202) 691-7000 USDL-09-0171 CPI QUICKLINE: (202) 691-6994 TRANSMISSION OF FOR CURRENT AND HISTORICAL MATERIAL IN THIS INFORMATION: (202) 691-5200 RELEASE IS EMBARGOED MEDIA CONTACT: (202) 691-5902 UNTIL 8:30 A.M. (EST) INTERNET ADDRESS: Consumer Price Index (CPI) Friday, February 20, 2009 CONSUMER PRICE INDEX: JANUARY 2009 The Consumer Price Index for All Urban Consumers (CPI-U) increased 0.4 percent in January, before seasonal adjustment, the Bureau of Labor Statistics of the U.S. Department of Labor reported today. The January level of 211.143 (1982-84=100) was virtually unchanged from January 2008. The Consumer Price Index for Urban Wage Earners and Clerical Workers (CPI-W) increased 0.4 percent in January, prior to seasonal adjustment. The January level of 205.700 (1982-84=100) was 0.5 percent lower than in January 2008. The Chained Consumer Price Index for All Urban Consumers (C-CPI-U) increased 0.5 percent in January on a not seasonally adjusted basis. The January level of 121.208 (December 1999=100) was 0.5 percent lower than in January 2008. Please note that the indexes for the post-2007 period are subject to revision. CPI for All Urban Consumers (CPI-U) On a seasonally adjusted basis, the CPI-U increased 0.3 percent in January after declining in each of the three previous months. The energy index climbed 1.7 percent in January, its first increase in six months, but it was still 31.4 percent below its July 2008 peak level. Within energy, the gasoline index rose 6.0 percent in January after a 19.3 percent decline in December. However, some energy components continued to decline; the fuel oil index fell 3.7 percent in January and the index for natural gas declined 3.6 percent. The food index, which rose sharply during the summer and moderated through the fall, increased 0.1 percent in January after being virtually unchanged in December. The food index has risen 5.3 percent over the past year. The (cont.) Table A. Percent changes in CPI for All Urban Consumers (CPI-U) Seasonally adjusted Expenditure Compound Category Changes from preceding month annual Un- rate adjusted 3-mos. 12-mos. July Aug. Sep. Oct. Nov. Dec. Jan. ended ended 2008 2008 2008 2008 2008 2008 2009 Jan. 2009 Jan. 2009 All items.......... .7 .0 .0 -.8 -1.7 -.8 .3 -8.4 .0 Food and beverages .9 .6 .5 .4 .2 .1 .1 1.4 5.2 Housing........... .6 .0 -.1 .0 -.1 .0 .0 -.3 2.2 Apparel........... 1.0 .4 -.3 -.7 .1 -.6 .3 -.9 -.9 Transportation.... 1.4 -.9 -.1 -4.8 -9.7 -5.0 1.3 -43.0 -12.6 Medical care...... .1 .2 .3 .2 .2 .3 .4 3.9 2.6 Recreation........ .3 .4 .2 .2 .0 -.2 .0 -.5 1.6 Education and communication.. .5 .2 .1 .2 .2 .3 .3 3.3 3.6 Other goods and services....... .4 .2 .2 .3 .0 .0 .3 1.5 3.3 Special indexes: Energy............ 3.5 -2.0 -1.0 -7.8 -16.9 -9.3 1.7 -65.4 -20.4 Food.............. .9 .6 .5 .4 .2 .0 .1 1.1 5.3 All items less food and energy .3 .2 .1 .0 .1 .0 .2 .9 1.7 food at home index declined 0.1 percent in January as the fruits and vegetables index continued to fall. The index for all items less food and energy rose 0.2 percent in January after being virtually unchanged in December. Contributing to the increase were larger advances in the indexes for rent and owners equivalent rent and upturns in the indexes for new vehicles and apparel. The food and beverages index increased 0.1 percent in January, the same increase as in December. A 0.3 percent increase in the index for food away from home and a 0.2 percent rise in the alcoholic beverages index more than offset a 0.1 percent decline in the food at home index. The food at home index has risen 5.7 percent over the past year. Within food at home, the indexes for four of the six major grocery store food groups declined in January. The index for fruits and vegetables fell 1.3 percent, its fifth consecutive monthly decline. The index for fresh fruits fell 2.2 percent and the fresh vegetables index declined 1.6 percent. The dairy and related products index, down 1.1 percent in December, fell 0.6 percent in January, with the milk index declining 1.4 percent. Also declining in January were the indexes for meats, poultry, fish and eggs and for nonalcoholic beverages, each down 0.1 percent. The index for cereals and bakery products was virtually unchanged in January, but was still up 11.3 percent over the last year. The index for other food at home rose 0.6 percent in January, the only major grocery store food group index to increase for the month. The housing index was virtually unchanged in January for the second straight month. However the shelter index, virtually unchanged in December, rose 0.2 percent in January. Over the last 12 months, the housing index has risen 2.2 percent and the index for shelter was up 1.8 percent. Within shelter, the indexes for rent and owners' equivalent rent both rose 0.3 percent in January after rising 0.2 percent and 0.1 percent, respectively, in December. The index for lodging away from home fell 1.1 percent in January and has declined 4.7 percent over the past 12 months. The household energy index fell 0.9 percent in January, its sixth consecutive monthly decline. Within household energy, the electricity index rose 0.2 percent, but the indexes for fuel oil and natural gas both declined. Despite the recent declines, the household energy index was up 4.9 percent over the past 12 months. The index for household furnishings and operations turned down in January, declining 0.1 percent after increasing 0.1 percent in December. The transportation index rose for the first time since July, increasing 1.3 percent in January. The index has declined 12.6 percent over the past 12 months. The index for motor fuel, which had been declining in recent months, rose 5.3 percent in January. However, the motor fuel index is still 48.1 percent below its peak in July. The index for new and used motor vehicles increased in January after posting 12 straight declines, rising 0.2 percent. The index for new vehicles rose 0.3 percent in January but has declined 2.6 percent over the past year. The index for public transportation continued to decline, falling 1.8 percent in January. The airline fare index fell 2.1 percent in January and was down 0.9 percent compared to a year ago. After declining 0.6 percent in December, the apparel index turned up in January, rising 0.3 percent. The index for men's and boys' apparel rose 1.6 percent and the index for women's and girls' apparel rose 0.2 percent. (On a not seasonally adjusted basis, the apparel index declined 2.0 percent in January and was down 0.9 percent over the last 12 months.) The medical care index climbed 0.4 percent in January following a 0.2 percent increase in November and a 0.3 percent advance in December. The index for medical care commodities rose 0.4 percent, with the prescription drugs index rising 0.5 percent. The medical care services index rose 0.5 percent in January. Within this group, the index for physicians' services rose 0.2 percent and the hospital and related services index increased 0.8 percent. The index for recreation, down 0.2 percent in December, was virtually unchanged in January. The indexes for photography, toys, admissions, and for pets, pet products and services all rose in January. These increases offset declines in the indexes for video and audio and for sporting goods. The recreation index is up 1.6 percent over the past 12 months. The education and communication index increased 0.3 percent in January and was up 3.6 percent over the past year. The education index, which rose 0.5 percent in December, advanced 0.3 percent in January. The index for communication climbed 0.2 percent for the second straight month. Within communication, the telephone services index rose 0.2 percent and the index for information technology, hardware and services increased 0.1 percent. After being virtually unchanged in December, the index for other goods and services rose 0.3 percent in January and was up 3.3 percent over the past 12 months. The index for tobacco and smoking products rose 0.8 percent in January, while the personal care index increased 0.1 percent. CPI for Urban Wage Earners and Clerical Workers (CPI-W) On a seasonally adjusted basis, the CPI for Urban Wage Earners and Clerical Workers increased 0.3 percent in January. Table B. Percent changes in CPI for Urban Wage Earners and Clerical Workers (CPI-W) Seasonally adjusted Expenditure Compound Category Changes from preceding month annual Un- rate adjusted 3-mos. 12-mos. July Aug. Sep. Oct. Nov. Dec. Jan. ended ended 2008 2008 2008 2008 2008 2008 2009 Jan. 2009 Jan. 2009 All items.......... .8 .0 .0 -1.0 -2.1 -1.0 .3 -10.5 -.5 Food and beverages .9 .6 .5 .4 .2 .1 .0 1.2 5.3 Housing........... .6 .0 -.1 .0 .0 .0 .0 .1 2.6 Apparel........... .8 .6 .0 -1.0 .0 -.6 .6 .3 -.8 Transportation.... 1.5 -1.1 -.1 -5.3 -10.9 -5.6 1.5 -46.8 -14.5 Medical care...... .1 .3 .3 .1 .2 .3 .4 3.8 2.6 Recreation........ .3 .4 .2 .1 .0 -.1 .0 -.5 1.5 Education and communication.. .5 .2 .0 .2 .2 .3 .2 2.8 3.3 Other goods and services....... .5 .2 .2 .3 .1 .1 .4 2.5 3.9 Special indexes: Energy............ 3.5 -2.0 -.8 -8.2 -17.8 -9.7 1.9 -67.3 -21.7 Food.............. .9 .6 .5 .4 .2 .1 .0 1.0 5.4 All items less food and energy .3 .2 .1 .0 .1 .0 .2 1.2 1.7 Consumer Price Index data for February are scheduled for release on Wednesday, March 18, 2009, at 8:30 A.M. (EDT). Revised seasonally adjusted changes Over-the-month percent changes in the U.S. City Average Consumer Price Index for All Urban Consumers (CPI-U) for All Items and for All Items less food and energy, seasonally adjusted, using former and recalculated seasonal factors for 2008. All Items 2008 Former Recalculated Difference January .4 .4 .0 February .0 .2 .2 March .3 .4 .1 April .2 .2 .0 May .6 .5 -.1 June 1.1 .9 -.2 July .8 .7 -.1 August -.1 .0 .1 September 0 .0 .0 October -1.0 -.8 .2 November -1.7 -1.7 .0 December -.7 -.8 -.1 All Items less food and energy 2008 Former Recalculated Difference January .3 .3 .0 February .0 .1 .1 March .2 .2 .0 April .1 .1 .0 May .2 .2 .0 June .3 .3 .0 July .3 .3 .0 August .2 .2 .0 September .1 .1 .0 October -.1 .0 .1 November .0 .1 .1 December .0 .0 .0 C-CPI-U Index Revisions In accordance with the previously-announced schedule, the Bureau of Labor Statistics is revising the 2007 and 2008 values of the Chained Consumer Price Index for All Urban Consumers (C-CPI-U), effective with the release of January 2009 data. The C-CPI-U was introduced with release of July data on August 16, 2002. The index in its final form employs a Tornqvist formula and utilizes expenditure data in adjacent time periods in order to reflect the effect of any substitution that consumers make across item categories in response to changes in relative prices. The C-CPI-U was designed to be a closer approximation to a "cost-of-living" index than the CPI-U and CPI-W. The use of expenditure data for both a base period and a current period distinguishes the C-CPI-U from the other CPI measures, which use only a single expenditure base period to compute price change over time. Because the current expenditure data required for the calculation of the C-CPI-U are available only with a time lag, the index is issued first in preliminary form, using the latest available expenditure data at the time of publication, and is subject to two subsequent revisions. The preliminary values for each month of the preceding two years are revised annually with release of the January index. Expenditure data for the year 2007 are now available, and the C-CPI-U indexes for that year are now in final form. The initial indexes for 2008 are now revised interim indexes. The C-CPI-U U.S. All Items index values for 2007 and 2008 as originally published and revised are shown below. For more information on the C-CPI-U, write to: Bureau of Labor Statistics Division of Consumer Prices and Price Indexes 2 Massachusetts Ave. NE, Room 3130 Washington, DC 20212 Or contact Rob Cage either by telephone at (202) 691-6959 or by electronic mail at Cage.Rob@bls.gov U.S. City Average C-CPI-U All Items 2007 Interim Final January 117.310 117.330 February 117.897 117.877 March 118.978 118.913 April 119.712 119.666 May 120.290 120.292 June 120.478 120.439 July 120.384 120.377 August 120.198 120.288 September 120.538 120.638 October 120.823 120.885 November 121.443 121.481 December 121.322 121.295 Annual average 119.948 119.957 2008 Initial Interim January 121.895 121.868 February 122.251 122.224 March 123.204 123.177 April 123.845 123.817 May 124.645 124.617 June 125.582 125.554 July 126.116 126.088 August 125.843 125.815 September 125.774 125.746 October 124.784 124.757 November 122.284 122.257 December 120.661 120.634 Annual average n.a. 123.880 Facilities for Sensory Impaired Information from this release will be made available to sensory impaired individuals upon request. Voice phone: 202-691-5200, Federal Relay Services: 1-800-877-8339. Brief Explanation of the CPI The Consumer Price Index (CPI) is a measure of the average change in prices over time of goods and services purchased by households. The Bureau of Labor Statistics publishes CPIs for two population groups: (1) the CPI for Urban Wage Earners and Clerical Workers (CPI-W), which covers households of wage earners and clerical workers that comprise approximately 32 percent of the total population and (2) the CPI for All Urban Consumers (CPI-U) and the Chained CPI for All Urban Consumers (C-CPI- U), which cover approximately 87 percent of the total population and include in addition to wage earners and clerical worker households, groups such as professional, managerial, and technical workers, the self- employed, short-term workers, the unemployed, and retirees and others not in the labor force. The CPIs are based on prices of food, clothing, shelter, and fuels, transportation fares, charges for doctors' and dentists' services, drugs, and other goods and services that people buy for day-to-day living. Prices are collected in 87 urban areas across the country from about 50,000 housing units and approximately 23,000 retail establishments- department stores, supermarkets, hospitals, filling stations, and other types of stores and service establishments. All taxes directly associated with the purchase and use of items are included in the index. Prices of fuels and a few other items are obtained every month in all 87 locations. Prices of most other commodities and services are collected every month in the three largest geographic areas and every other month in other areas. Prices of most goods and services are obtained by personal visits or telephone calls of the Bureau's trained representatives. In calculating the index, price changes for the various items in each location are averaged together with weights, which represent their importance in the spending of the appropriate population group. Local data are then combined to obtain a U.S. city average. For the CPI-U and CPI-W separate indexes are also published by size of city, by region of the country, for cross-classifications of regions and population-size classes, and for 27 local areas. Area indexes do not measure differences in the level of prices among cities; they only measure the average change in prices for each area since the base period. For the C-CPI-U data are issued only at the national level. It is important to note that the CPI-U and CPI-W are considered final when released, but the C-CPI-U is issued in preliminary form and subject to two annual revisions. The index measures price change from a designed reference date. For the CPI-U and the CPI-W the reference base is 1982-84 equals 100.0. The reference base for the C-CPI-U is December 1999 equals 100. An increase of 16.5 percent from the reference base, for example, is shown as 116.5. This change can also be expressed in dollars as follows: the price of a base period market basket of goods and services in the CPI has risen from $10 in 1982-84 to $11.65. For further details visit the CPI home page on the Internet at Consumer Price Index (CPI) or contact our CPI Information and Analysis Section on (202) 691-7000. Note on Sampling Error in the Consumer Price Index The CPI is a statistical estimate that is subject to sampling error because it is based upon a sample of retail prices and not the complete universe of all prices. BLS calculates and publishes estimates of the 1- month, 2-month, 6-month and 12-month percent change standard errors annually, for the CPI-U. These standard error estimates can be used to construct confidence intervals for hypothesis testing. For example, the estimated standard error of the 1 month percent change is 0.06 percent for the U.S. All Items Consumer Price Index. This means that if we repeatedly sample from the universe of all retail prices using the same methodology, and estimate a percentage change for each sample, then 95% of these estimates would be within 0.12 percent of the 1 month percentage change based on all retail prices. For a 1-month change of 0.2 percent in the All Items CPI for All Urban Consumers, we are 95 percent confident that the actual percent change based on all retail prices would fall between 0.08 and 0.32 percent. For the latest data, including information on how to use the estimates of standard error, see "Variance Estimates for Changes in the Consumer Price Index, January 2005- December 2005" in the CPI Detailed Report, February 2006. These data are available on the CPI home page (Consumer Price Index (CPI)), using the following link http://www.bls.gov/cpi/cpivar2006.pdf Calculating Index Changes Movements of the indexes from one month to another are usually expressed as percent changes rather than changes in index points, because index point changes are affected by the level of the index in relation to its base period while percent changes are not. The example below illustrates the computation of index point and percent changes. Percent changes for 3-month and 6-month periods are expressed as annual rates and are computed according to the standard formula for compound growth rates. These data indicate what the percent change would be if the current rate were maintained for a 12-month period. Index Point Change CPI 202.416 Less previous index 201.800 Equals index point change .616 Percent Change Index point difference .616 Divided by the previous index 201.800 Equals 0.003 Results multiplied by one hundred 0.003x100 Equals percent change 0.3 Regions DefinedThe states in the four regions shown in Tables 3 and 6 are listed below.The Northeast--Connecticut, Maine, Massachusetts, New Hampshire, New York,New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, and Vermont.The Midwest--Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Michigan, Minnesota,Missouri, Nebraska, North Dakota, Ohio, South Dakota, and Wisconsin.The South--Alabama, Arkansas, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Kentucky,Louisiana, Maryland, Mississippi, North Carolina, Oklahoma, South Carolina,Tennessee, Texas, Virginia, West Virginia, and the District of Columbia.The West--Alaska, Arizona, California, Colorado, Hawaii, Idaho, Montana,Nevada, New Mexico, Oregon, Utah, Washington, and Wyoming. A Note on Seasonally Adjusted and Unadjusted Data Because price data are used for different purposes by different groups, the Bureau of Labor Statistics publishes seasonally adjusted as well as unadjusted changes each month. For analyzing general price trends in the economy, seasonally adjusted changes are usually preferred since they eliminate the effect of changes that normally occur at the same time and in about the same magnitude every year--such as price movements resulting from changing climatic conditions, production cycles, model changeovers, holidays, and sales. The unadjusted data are of primary interest to consumers concerned about the prices they actually pay. Unadjusted data also are used extensively for escalation purposes. Many collective bargaining contract agreements and pension plans, for example, tie compensation changes to the Consumer Price Index before adjustment for seasonal variation. Seasonal factors used in computing the seasonally adjusted indexes are derived by the X-12-ARIMA Seasonal Adjustment Method. Seasonally adjusted indexes and seasonal factors are computed annually. Each year, the last 5 years of seasonally adjusted data are revised. Data from January 2004 through December 2008 were replaced in January 2009. Exceptions to the usual revision schedule were: the updated seasonal data at the end of 1977 replaced data from 1967 through 1977; and, in January 2002, dependently seasonally adjusted series were revised for January 1987- December 2001 as a result of a change in the aggregation weights for dependently adjusted series. For further information, please see "Aggregation of Dependently Adjusted Seasonally Adjusted Series," in the October 2001 issue of the CPI Detailed Report. The seasonal movement of all items and 54 other aggregations is derived by combining the seasonal movement of 73 selected components. Each year the seasonal status of every series is reevaluated based upon certain statistical criteria. If any of the 73 components change their seasonal adjustment status from seasonally adjusted to not seasonally adjusted, not seasonally adjusted data will be used in the aggregation of the dependent series for the last 5 years, but the seasonally adjusted indexes will be used before that period. Note: 47 of the 73 components are seasonally adjusted for 2009. Seasonally adjusted data, including the all items index levels, are subject to revision for up to five years after their original release. For this reason, BLS advises against the use of these data in escalation agreements. Effective with the calculation of the seasonal factors for 1990, the Bureau of Labor Statistics has used an enhanced seasonal adjustment procedure called Intervention Analysis Seasonal Adjustment for some CPI series. Intervention Analysis Seasonal Adjustment allows for better estimates of seasonally adjusted data. Extreme values and/or sharp movements which might distort the seasonal pattern are estimated and removed from the data prior to calculation of seasonal factors. Beginning with the calculation of seasonal factors for 1996, X-12-ARIMA software was used for Intervention Analysis Seasonal Adjustment. For the seasonal factors introduced in January 2009, BLS adjusted 29 series using Intervention Analysis Seasonal Adjustment, including selected food and beverage items, motor fuels, electricity and vehicles. For example, this procedure was used for the Motor fuel series to offset the effects of events such as damage to oil refineries from Hurricane Katrina. For a complete list of Intervention Analysis Seasonal Adjustment series and explanations, please refer to the article "Intervention Analysis Seasonal Adjustment", located on our website at Seasonal Adjustment in the CPI. For additional information on seasonal adjustment in the CPI, please write to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, Division of Consumer Prices and Price Indexes, Washington, DC 20212 or contact Jeff Wilson at (202) 691- 6968, or by e-mail at Wilson.Jeff@bls.gov. If you have general questions about the CPI, please call our information staff at (202) 691-7000. .
    The PDF version of the news release

    Table of Contents

    Last Modified Date: February 20, 2009

  4. #34
    Elite Member cynic's Avatar
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    ...there are your inflation figures including food.....study up....you'll be tested later.....

  5. #35
    Gold Member eeyore0101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cynic View Post
    ...there are your inflation figures including food.....study up....you'll be tested later.....
    Oh, my aching head!
    Is it Happy Hour yet?

  6. #36
    Elite Member cynic's Avatar
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    ^^sorry, I know women like to argue on the basis of their "feelings", but I prefer facts and figures myself.....

  7. #37
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    manifesto!
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

  8. #38
    Gold Member eeyore0101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cynic View Post
    ^^sorry, I know women like to argue on the basis of their "feelings", but I prefer facts and figures myself.....
    Hey now, that sounds a little sexist ya know!
    Is it Happy Hour yet?

  9. #39
    Elite Member cynic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grimmlok View Post
    manifesto!
    ..and here I thought you would be proud that I learned to post articles....


    Quote Originally Posted by eeyore0101 View Post
    Hey now, that sounds a little sexist ya know!
    ..most of the women here are sexist....I'm just defending myself.....

  10. #40
    Elite Member greysfang's Avatar
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    And the figures you posted prove my point perfectly, thanks.
    FUCK YOU AND GIVE ME MY GODDAMN VENTI TWO PUMP LIGHT WHIP MOCHA YOU COCKSUCKING WHORE BEFORE I PUNCH YOU IN THE MOUTH. I just get unpleasant in my car. - Deej

    http://www.gossiprocks.com/forum/signaturepics/sigpic4098_9.gif Healthy is merely the slowest possible rate at which one can die.

  11. #41
    Elite Member cynic's Avatar
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    ^^which ones?

  12. #42
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    .. salaries haven't kept pace with the price of manifestos..
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

  13. #43
    Elite Member cynic's Avatar
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    ....you only wish you were paid by the word.....that manifesto nearly broke me..........I wasn't the one asking for more statistics......it falls under the "watch what you ask for" category.....

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    ^^sorry, I know women like to argue on the basis of their "feelings", but I prefer facts and figures myself....
    I'll just go back to my little job now...

  15. #45
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    ^^ in the kitchen?


    *ducks*
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

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