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Thread: Barack Obama's spiritual advisor: Hillary Clinton ain't never been called a N*gger!

  1. #46
    Elite Member kingcap72's Avatar
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    ^^That's true, to an extent. But just because you know somebody that's a racist, anti-Semite, homophobe or sexist doesn't mean that you automatically share the same beliefs just because you know them.

    And considering that this guy is Obama's pastor that he's known for almost 20 years I can understand why he doesn't outright denounce the man like he did his comments. That's hard to do with somebody that's been a longtime friend. Much like Hillary didn't come out an denounce her friend Ferraro but she denounced her comments. (Yeah, I went there with Hillary, Grim.)

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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Um, i don't care about Hillary and I'm not one of her Hillbots. Not everyone who looks askance at Obama is some Clintonista cyborg

    What I find amusing is the proclivity to suddenly denounce the words or actions of long-time friends only after you've been caught.
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  3. #48
    Elite Member kingcap72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grimmlok View Post
    Um, i don't care about Hillary and I'm not one of her Hillbots. Not everyone who looks askance at Obama is some Clintonista cyborg

    What I find amusing is the proclivity to suddenly denounce the words or actions of long-time friends only after you've been caught.
    I know you're not a Hill-bot, Grim. The reason why I wrote 'yeah I took it there' was because you always accuse me of bringing up Hillary when somebody says something about Obama.

    And I think when any politician decides to run for office they need to look around at all of their longtime friends and associates and see which was is going to be a detriment to their campaign, and cut them lose right from the start. That way, they save themselves a lot of grief.

  4. #49
    Elite Member southernbelle's Avatar
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    The problem I have with the situation is that this man was his spiritual advisor for 20 years. Obama has admitted that he was aware of this speech long before we were. He only denounced the pastor and cut ties with him AFTER this footage became public. He continued to credit, associate with, and praise this man and the church that backs his ignorant and racist propaganda despite being aware of these comments. That makes me feel like Obama doesn't have a problem with what Wright believes or says; He just has a problem with other people finding out that the man he credits with being his spiritual mentor is actually a fervent racist whose idea of a powerful sermon is to scream, "God damn America!" and let loose with a stream of expletives and disparaging remarks about other individuals and races. I find that very offensive and very troubling.

    If their beliefs are so drastically different, why did Obama continue to go to him for spiritual guidance? This is more than just happening to be a member of a church where one person is racist. He's a member of a church that is founded on racism and anti-American sentiments. Why would anyone in their right mind join a church if they found the things that the church stood for to be offensive? I believe that if Obama truly in his heart disagreed with what that church and Wright stand for, he would have cut ties with them long ago instead of simply trying to cover his own backside when their true natures are revealed.

    I agree with Grimm that you can tell a lot about a person by the company they keep. To me, Obama's church is not like any form of Christianity that I'm aware of. I wouldn't support a candidate who belonged to a white supremacist group, and I won't support a candidate who belongs to a black supremacist group, and that's what I feel his church is at its core.

  5. #50
    Elite Member nycgirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingcap72 View Post
    Obama's not the one that made the statements, his pastor did. And just because his pastor has a certain idealogy doesn't mean that Obama or his church have it. For example, you have Catholic priests that are pedophiles, that doesn't make everyone in their congregation pedophiles, too.

    I don't know why people keep trying to attack Obama's patriotism, first the flag pin, then the alleged Pledge of Allegiance snub, and now this.
    Yeah and Hillary's not the one who made the statements about Jesse Jackson winning SC or Obama being in his position because of his skin color either, but people always say she's playing the race card and mention these comments time and time again. Are we not allowed to do the same to Obama? The bottom line is the company someone keeps (especially if he's been his spiritual advisor/pastor for 20 years) reflects on them. One would think Obama would know, after 20 years, that this guy is a wackjob and somewhat Anti- American. But it seems like he only denounced him after his tirade was caught on video.

    And sorry that this pastor hates America so much. Wonder why he doesn't just leave? I'm sure we could do without him, one less mental midget in the country.
    Last edited by nycgirl; March 15th, 2008 at 04:48 PM.

  6. #51
    Elite Member *DIVA!'s Avatar
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    Reverend Wright served his country as a Marine. His feelings about how he sees America is founded in his own heart for some reason. He served his country, but at the time he was serving WE don't know what happened to him. You don't have to be proud of, or even love the country you live in all the time. He lived in a time when this country was separated and defined by race like so many others, that maybe he can't see beyond the hurt he felt and still has the lines drawn in the sand. This doesn't excuse that his statements are wrong, and divisive..but unless you know his complete struggle you can't define anyone in his congregation by them. Ron Paul has said on many occasions that America's actions over the years have caused the terrorist to come after us here, and our further involvement in their affairs will continue them to view America as an enemy that needs taken out. I have older relatives that view white people as evil to this day, but will not vote for a black person for any level of office-their logic is scary and confusing..but you can't change their feelings, nor views. I love them with all my heart and I listen to them because they are wise and have lived through some horrific things..but I don't agree with them at all. You can love, respect, and admire someone and not agree with them. You can also belong to a Church and not know all the things your Preacher says and believes...Especially if he doesn't preach the same damn sermon EVERY week. He rejected these statements a year ago..but I guess no one was listening to him at that time.
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  7. #52
    Elite Member kingcap72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nycgirly101 View Post
    Yeah and Hillary's not the one who made the statements about Jesse Jackson winning SC or Obama being in his position because of his skin color either, but people always say she's playing the race card and mention these comments time and time again. Are we not allowed to do the same to Obama? The bottom line is the company someone keeps (especially if he's been his spiritual advisor/pastor for 20 years) reflects on them. One would think Obama would know, after 20 years, that this guy is a wackjob and somewhat Anti- American. But it seems like he only denounced him after his tirade was caught on video.

    And sorry that this pastor hates America so much. Wonder why he doesn't just leave? I'm sure we could do without him, one less mental midget in the country.
    Of course people should question Obama about his association with a pastor that hates America, especially since he's running for president. But to assume that because his pastor hates America that Obama must hate the country too is a stretch. Although I'll admit, it was a dumb move on Obama's part to still associate with the man once he knew he was running for president, no matter how long he's known him.

    As for Hillary, she's the one that made the statement in Louisiana after Obama won about the African-American voters. That's what I hold her responsible for.

    And, you're right, the company that somebody keeps does reflect on them, but it doesn't define them. And like I wrote earlier, just because Obama's pastor may hate America doesn't automatically mean he does, either. Now, Ferraro made statements about Obama's race which could be construed as racist, but does that make Hillary a racist? No.

  8. #53
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    I have to question the whole "he hates america" thing. Does criticism = hate?

    America DOEs bring a lot of the shit that happens to it on itself. Half the crazies gunning for it were armed and funded by America, only to have them turn on their masters.

    State sponsored terrorism and exploitation is still terrorism and exploitation, but it has a nicer suit and faster car.
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  9. #54
    Elite Member southernbelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grimmlok View Post
    I have to question the whole "he hates america" thing. Does criticism = hate?

    America DOEs bring a lot of the shit that happens to it on itself. Half the crazies gunning for it were armed and funded by America, only to have them turn on their masters.

    State sponsored terrorism and exploitation is still terrorism and exploitation, but it has a nicer suit and faster car.
    Grimm, you make some good points but to me there is a difference in criticism and in repeatedly shouting "God damn America!" to a congregation of people. The latter, to me, definitely qualifies as hatred.

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    Elite Member suede's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ingi View Post
    Are there any white cab drivers left in Manhattan?

    LOL

    I don't know why that's funny to me, I don't remember any white american cabbies growing up.
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  11. #56
    Elite Member Mr. Authority's Avatar
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    I'd wish they drop the damn race/woman bullshit and talk about the issues. Out of 50 article online, only 5 of them had both Hillary and Obama talking about what they're gonna do when thye get in office. everything else "he said she said" petty schoolkid bullshit.

    They're giving ammo to the mainstream media to paint them as fools while letting McCain look sane.

  12. #57
    Elite Member kingcap72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Authority View Post
    I'd wish they drop the damn race/woman bullshit and talk about the issues. Out of 50 article online, only 5 of them had both Hillary and Obama talking about what they're gonna do when thye get in office. everything else "he said she said" petty schoolkid bullshit.

    They're giving ammo to the mainstream media to paint them as fools while letting McCain look sane.
    Agree 100% The Dems are, once again, shooting themselves in the foot.

  13. #58
    Elite Member crumpet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by southernbelle View Post
    The problem I have with the situation is that this man was his spiritual advisor for 20 years. Obama has admitted that he was aware of this speech long before we were. He only denounced the pastor and cut ties with him AFTER this footage became public. He continued to credit, associate with, and praise this man and the church that backs his ignorant and racist propaganda despite being aware of these comments. That makes me feel like Obama doesn't have a problem with what Wright believes or says; He just has a problem with other people finding out that the man he credits with being his spiritual mentor is actually a fervent racist whose idea of a powerful sermon is to scream, "God damn America!" and let loose with a stream of expletives and disparaging remarks about other individuals and races. I find that very offensive and very troubling.

    If their beliefs are so drastically different, why did Obama continue to go to him for spiritual guidance? This is more than just happening to be a member of a church where one person is racist. He's a member of a church that is founded on racism and anti-American sentiments. Why would anyone in their right mind join a church if they found the things that the church stood for to be offensive? I believe that if Obama truly in his heart disagreed with what that church and Wright stand for, he would have cut ties with them long ago instead of simply trying to cover his own backside when their true natures are revealed.

    I agree with Grimm that you can tell a lot about a person by the company they keep. To me, Obama's church is not like any form of Christianity that I'm aware of. I wouldn't support a candidate who belonged to a white supremacist group, and I won't support a candidate who belongs to a black supremacist group, and that's what I feel his church is at its core.
    I agree with practically all of this. Nobody else would get a pass for having an association with someone saying these things and neither should he.

  14. #59
    Elite Member crumpet's Avatar
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    You don't have to be proud of, or even love the country you live in all the time. He lived in a time when this country was separated and defined by race like so many others, that maybe he can't see beyond the hurt he felt and still has the lines drawn in the sand. This doesn't excuse that his statements are wrong, and divisive..but unless you know his complete struggle you can't define anyone in his congregation by them.
    He is running for POTUS, not Dog Catcher. Image is extremely important, as is public perception. No one running for President should be friendly with anyone saying hateful thinks about the US. He isn't running for black POTUS, so the opinions of lots of other people count just as much, if not more, since he cannot win on the black vote alone. Associating with this man just supports peoples' fears that he would sympathize with 'the enemy' because people pretty much expect the most powerful person in charge of running the country will be loyal. The reverend, like many others, have a valid perception based on their experiences. However, he is a major liability and he should be.

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    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    Lets propose this question:

    If Hillary Clinton had been married in a White Church, and baptized Chelsea there, attended services there for 20 years, and it was found out that the pastor was giving these type sermons, what do you think the reaction would be?

    Would it be called a "non-issue", as it's being called by the Obama campaign?

    We need to use the same yardstick on all candidates.



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