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Thread: Illegal immigrants might get stimulus jobs, experts say

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    Elite Member NicoleWasHere's Avatar
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    Thumbs down Illegal immigrants might get stimulus jobs, experts say

    Illegal immigrants might get stimulus jobs, experts say



    LOS ANGELES Tens of thousands of jobs created by the economic stimulus law could end up filled by illegal immigrants, particularly in big states such as California where undocumented workers are heavily represented in construction, experts on both sides of the issue say.

    Studies by two conservative think tanks estimate immigrants in the United States illegally could take 300,000 construction jobs, or 15% of the 2 million jobs that new taxpayer-financed projects are predicted to create.

    They fault Congress for failing to require that employers certify legal immigration status of workers before hiring by using a Department of Homeland Security program called E-Verify. The program allows employers to check the validity of Social Security numbers provided by new hires. It is available to employers on a voluntary basis.


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    "They could have deterred this, but they chose not to," said Steven Camarota, director of research for the Center for Immigration Studies.

    He said a federal requirement that employers use E-Verify would have reduced, if not eliminated, the hiring of immigrants in this country illegally.

    An advocacy group for immigrants, illegal and legal, did not disagree with the 300,000 estimate. Camarota says the estimate is based on data from the U.S. Census Bureau's Current Population Survey and other independent findings that 15% of all construction workers in the USA are either illegal immigrants or lack the status of legal immigrant authorized to work.

    But Jorge-Mario Cabrera, director of education for the Coalition for Humane Immigrant Rights of Los Angeles, said it is impossible to predict with certainty because it is unknown how many jobless immigrant construction workers may leave the U.S., frustrated by the economic recession, before the new spending produces jobs.
    He questioned the Center for Immigration Studies' motives.

    "Those are fear tactics. 'The immigrants are here to take your job,' " Cabrera said. "I think that we really should be focusing on economic progress for all."

    The center is a Washington policy organization that, its website says, "seeks fewer immigrants but a warmer welcome for those admitted." Cabrera says his group believes unauthorized immigrants working in this country contribute to the economy.

    A similar hiring estimate was produced in a report in February by the Heritage Foundation, a conservative think tank. Senior research fellow Robert Rector wrote, "Without specific mechanisms to ensure that workers are U.S. citizens or legal immigrants authorized to work, it is likely that 15% of these workers, or 300,000, would be illegal immigrants."

    The version of the stimulus bill passed by the House of Representatives included a provision requiring employers to check immigration status with the E-Verify system before hiring. The Senate did not include such a provision, and it was not in the version sent to President Obama. The Obama administration has delayed until at least May 21 a Bush administration executive order requiring federal contractors to use the E-Verify system in hiring. It had been scheduled to take effect in January. The U.S. Chamber of Commerce filed suit seeking to block the requirement, joined by the Associated Builders and Contractors and other business organizations.

    The business groups and immigrant advocacy groups argue that the E-Verify database is riddled with errors that could result in millions of workers being wrongly identified as not authorized for work. They say requiring its use before hiring would impose a cost burden on employers and open them to lawsuits.

    Camarota said illegal immigrants working in construction are concentrated in California, Arizona and Texas along the border with Mexico, as well as Florida, Illinois, New York, New Jersey, North Carolina and Georgia.

    Illegal immigrants might get stimulus jobs, experts say - USATODAY.com


    Never mind all of the LEGAL citizens who need the jobs...

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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    uh duh. i called this shit like months ago
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    Elite Member Little Wombat's Avatar
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    Illegal immigrants tend to take jobs Americans don't want or won't do. So, um, how do I say this? If Americans actually want and/or will do the construction jobs mentioned in the article, then there won't be any, or as many, illegal immigrants taking them.
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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Illegal immigrants take the jobs that the companies and corporations wont pay a living wage to be done
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    Elite Member msdeb's Avatar
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    they should be busting the companies that hire the illegals.
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    Well it's interesting that the Senate didn't put that e-verify requirement in the bill, nor was it in the final bill that went to President Obama. President also delayed Bush's requirement that all federal contractors use the e-verify system.

    I don't know anything about the construction industry but I assume that those hiring prefer "illegal immigrant labor" due to their cheaper wages and willingness to work in conditions native Americans wouldn't. I don't know if it's a good thing or a bad thing, maybe it's good for the economy I guess but not a good deal for the American construction worker unable to find a job.

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    Elite Member kingcap72's Avatar
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    Businesses, big and small, will continue to employ illegals for cheap wages, and no health insurance costs, as long as they can get away with it.

    Hell, some of the businesses will help cover up the fact that they're hiring illegals by helping them fake the documentation.

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    Elite Member Mel1973's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little Wombat View Post
    Illegal immigrants tend to take jobs Americans don't want or won't do. So, um, how do I say this? If Americans actually want and/or will do the construction jobs mentioned in the article, then there won't be any, or as many, illegal immigrants taking them.
    that's a myth. Impacts of Illegal Immigration: Jobs
    The MSM report ad nauseam that illegal aliens are only "doing work that Americans won't." This mantra is mercilessly bandied about by illegal supporters and echoes throughout the halls of Congress and the White House whenever the topic comes up. What is never mentioned, however, is that the illegal aliens are artificially depressing compensation and that illegal aliens are the only ones who will do the work at such low wages. In actual fact, illegal immigration distorts the law of supply and demand in a capitalistic society. Additionally it is grossly hypocritical to want to raise the minimum wage on one hand while the other hand winks at illegal aliens working at far below prevailing wages.
    In any case, illegal aliens are not just picking lettuce and digging ditches any more. It wasn't that long ago that being a dry-waller, brick-layer, house framer, painter, roofer, carpet layer, plumber, or electrician was a decently compensated, middle class trade. Now it is increasingly becoming the work for illegal aliens at far less than the free market rate. While illegal alien workers are only a small portion of many of those job categories their willingness to work at dramatically lower rates artificially drags down the compensation for all workers.
    When the resident poor and uneducated Americans can subsist on welfare they are not going to pick lettuce, dig ditches, clean toilets or wash dishes at minimum wage. However, if there are massive shortages of workers for such jobs, the forces of supply and demand will come in to play and the compensation for those jobs will rise to attract more workers. At some point, it will pay more than being on welfare and be attractive enough to turn off Oprah and the labor shortage will be alleviated.
    There are also side affects of "only doing the jobs that Americans won't do," at artificially depressed wages anyway. One is that it increases the load on the welfare systems as there are fewer working poor and more welfare recipients. Another is that many unscrupulous employers pay illegal aliens in cash, off-the-books, avoiding all taxes which also makes the illegal alien worker have little or no income "qualifying" them for welfare benefits as well.
    One of the problems with the MSM, the President, and Congress believing that only illegal aliens will do the work that Americans won't is that they must have never done any of that kind of work. It must be so beneath them that they just can't believe "Americans" will actually do it.
    When I was seventeen I was 6'2"and weighed 155 pounds. That summer I took a job in a Dole Pineapple plant where for 12 hours a day, six days a week for three months I had to lift, carry, throw, and stack 100 pound sacks of cattle feed. Working on the loading dock one day where the sacks were filled, it was my job to pick up a bag from two automatic filling machines and carry them eight feet or so to the edge of the dock and throw them into a truck. The two filling machines produced four bags a minute. That is 240 an hour and 2,880 a shift. At 100 pounds each that was 144 tons.
    It was hot, humid, dusty, stunk and I was paid minimum wage – with an agricultural exemption from any overtime. While Tennessee Ernie Ford wrote a song entitled "Sixteen Tons" about mining coal, we didn't get any songs written about us doing 144 tons – you just did the job.
    When I started that job I could barely pick up a 100 pound bag with two hands. At the end of the summer I still weighed 155 pounds but could pick up a bag with each hand and fling it ten feet. I also learned that it wasn't the kind of work I wanted to be doing for the rest of my life.
    Many of the people reading this report have similar stories and work experiences. These are the jobs that legal, students, and the working poor have been doing for the last 100 years. The jobs were not done by illegal aliens. Do we need a bona fide guest worker program to allow seasonal migrant workers from Mexico to come in and earn money picking lettuce? Probably, but I am tired of hearing that illegal aliens are only doing the work that Americans won't do because that is BS – I've done that work. I even did it in December 2006 when I spent five and a half hours snow shoveling 36 inches of snow from my around my and one of my neighbor's Colorado homes. I didn't want to do that work either but I did it because it had to be done. Where were all the illegal aliens when you really needed them?


    **There's alot more at the link but I don't want to paste the entire thing - it's quite interesting though.*
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    Silver Member chattykathy's Avatar
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    They need to start making illegals pay taxes. And medicaid. And anything else that they take out for a regular citizen, because illegals aren't going anywhere. Busting the chops of businesses that hire them would be a nice start, but I don't see that happening, so illegals just need taxes taken out of their checks like everyone else.
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    Elite Member cmmdee's Avatar
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    ^^ I agree

    Quote Originally Posted by Little Wombat View Post
    Illegal immigrants tend to take jobs Americans don't want or won't do.
    Quote Originally Posted by kingcap72 View Post
    Businesses, big and small, will continue to employ illegals for cheap wages, and no health insurance costs, as long as they can get away with it.

    Hell, some of the businesses will help cover up the fact that they're hiring illegals by helping them fake the documentation.
    True on both accounts.

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    Elite Member RevellingInSane's Avatar
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    It's a catch-22. If the illegals wouldn't work for pennies, and the companies employing them had to pay citizens, those costs would pass to the consumers. If we don't want to pay more, the illegals are the best option.

    Tax illegal immigrants and cut them off from receiving any and all types of government aid.



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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    that's basically slave labor.
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    Silver Member chattykathy's Avatar
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    I would be fine with them receiving gov't aid if they helped pay the taxes that fund those programs to begin with!
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    Elite Member kingcap72's Avatar
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    The best solution is to either force illegals to become citizens or deport them.

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    Elite Member Fluffy's Avatar
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    ^Guess the gov't should hire more Immigration officers so that they can deport these people.

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