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Thread: Terrified Republicans reluctantly embrace their nemesis, John McCain

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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Question Terrified Republicans reluctantly embrace their nemesis, John McCain

    The Republican political establishment is looking to the devil to deliver them, the man many have depicted as the incarnation of evil: John McCain.

    Republicans in the U.S. Congress are petrified about a November debacle, a fear stoked on May 3, when they lost their second straight special election in a district held by Republicans.

    The party's fundamental situation is terrible: Republicans are saddled with an enormously unpopular president, a war, a troubled economy and a Democratic opposition that's being energized by important constituent groups.

    "The generics are as bad as anytime since I have been here," said Representative Tom Davis, a Virginia Republican and one of the most politically astute members of Congress in either party. Davis, a 14-year veteran, is retiring this year, frustrated with his party's long-term prospects.

    In a delicious irony, the one bright spot is McCain, the presumptive Republican presidential nominee. A few months ago, McCain spoke to the party's caucus in the House of Representatives and said that he would campaign in any district where he was wanted and stay out of any where he would be a liability.

    "I don't know of anyone that doesn't want him in," said Representative Ray LaHood, an Illinois Republican who is also retiring.

    This is turning history on its head. Not long ago, the independent-minded McCain was vilified by his party's leaders.

    Tom DeLay - the former Republican majority leader who was once the most powerful official the House had had in years - complained that McCain "has done more to hurt the Republican Party than any elected official I know of." Former House Speaker Dennis Hastert once suggested that McCain, a decorated prisoner of war in Vietnam, didn't understand sacrifice.

    This year, Senator Thad Cochran of Mississippi said the thought of a McCain presidency "sends a cold chill down my spine." His former Mississippi colleague, Trent Lott, has endorsed McCain; eight years earlier, Lott's comments about the Arizona lawmaker were unprintable.

    The czar of conservative talk radio, Rush Limbaugh, said earlier this year that a McCain nomination would "destroy" Republicans: "He has stabbed his own party in the back I can't tell you how many times."

    There is a situational element to these attitudes; McCain is fine when he's useful to them.

    Former Senator Rick Santorum of Pennsylvania, facing an uphill re-election struggle in 2006, brought his old enemy into the state and tried to bask in his popularity. After Santorum was defeated, he reverted to form and trashed McCain.

    Similarly, the epiphany that many Republican officeholders have recently had about McCain is about their own fate: They're scared. Charlie Cook and Stu Rothenberg are the twin towers of Washington election-watchers; much of the conventional wisdom in this town originates with them.

    As of today, they both see the Democrats adding 5 to 10 seats to their House majority and gaining 3 to 6 Senate seats this November; that may be conservative.

    With few other reeds, embattled Republicans see McCain as a lifeboat. They know voters don't like President George W. Bush or being in bed with sleazy special interests. That's the identity of the national party.

    Few Republican lawmakers are viewed as more independent from Bush than is McCain - the two men really don't like each other - nor has there been any greater champion of ethics in politics than the 71-year-old senator.

    McCain also provides cover on issues that plague the Republican image: the party's immigration bashing and its insensitivity to environmental concerns, especially climate change.

    The odds, however, are that Republicans are deluding themselves - or at least exaggerating McCain's coattails.

    In addition to the unfavorable political environment, Democrats have won the important initial rounds in House and Senate races. In the House, they have recruited several dozen potentially solid challengers; the Republicans' candidate-recruitment efforts, by their admission, have been disappointing.

    In rating the current competitive House seats - about 1 in 10 - both Cook and Rothenberg see 50 percent more Republican-held seats at risk.

    There's a similar pattern in the Senate. More than a half-dozen strong Democratic candidates are competing for Republican-held seats in states from Maine to New Mexico. As of today, there's possibly one vulnerable Democratic incumbent, Mary Landrieu of Louisiana, and that may be a stretch.

    Moreover, the Democratic campaign chairmen, Representative Chris Van Hollen of Maryland and Senator Charles Schumer of New York, have run circles around the opposition.

    At the end of the first quarter, the two Democratic campaign committees had $82.1 million in the bank - over three times more than the $24.5 million held by Republicans. In two-thirds of the most competitive House contests, the Democrats have more money.

    "The money advantage is so overwhelming the Democrats are getting parity in what should be Republican districts," Davis said.

    In an effort to placate the party base, McCain has trimmed his sails and, perversely if unintentionally, looked more like a Bush Republican.

    "McCain comes across to some as a different kind of Republican," Van Hollen said. "Yet he has fallen in line with the Bush agenda on the fundamental issues: the war and the economy."

    The economy is the party's real potential vulnerable spot, since it's an issue of pervasive concern to voters, even more than Iraq. McCain has little interest in the subject, and a Bloomberg/Los Angeles Times poll shows that Americans give both Hillary Rodham Clinton and Barack Obama, the Democratic candidates, higher marks than McCain on the economy.

    Still, embattled Republican candidates won't have to drain time and energy explaining away their presidential candidate. From Congressman Christopher Shays of Connecticut to Robin Hayes of North Carolina, they can run with the head of the ticket.

    Their only task will be to explain all those awful anti-McCain diatribes from Republicans.

    Republicans forced to turn to their nemesis: John McCain - International Herald Tribune
    They won't need to explain their complete and hypocritical 180 on McSame.. they never do.
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

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    Elite Member southernbelle's Avatar
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    As a Republican, I wasn't thrilled with McCain as the nominee, but I'll definitely get behind him when it comes time to vote. I think that's what a lot of Republicans are experiencing. He wasn't initially their favorite, but since they don't want a Democrat in office, he is the candidate they plan to vote for and it's reaching the point where they need to start backing him for the sake of the party.

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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    yeah, another 4 years of Bush policies.. what's left to screw up?

    1) economy.. nope, done

    2) 2 endless wars.. nope done..

    3) environment.. nope, thats fucked..

    4) corruption.. still as rampant as ever..

    5) ridiculous social issues used as distraction.. nope, done..

    6) vast bankruptcy, corporate bailouts, more "self regulating industry" policies.. nope, already let that happen

    7) trillions of debt for stupid shit like war and tax cuts for the wealthy.. yeah, whynot, that'll really help


    Well i suppose 4 more years of that couldn't make things any worse than they already are.. he's pretty much fucked EVERYTHING up.

    I still don't get why anybody would vote for someone who worked for a party that maneged to fuck things up this badly. It's gotta be masochism. Either that, or they're in the top 5% of the country that did well under Bush while the rest went to hell.
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    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    McCain is not Bush 2. If thats the best smear the dems can come up with......thats sad.

    McCain and Bush have been opposed on numerous issues. They agreed on the war, and McCain understood early on that they were fighting it wrong.

    They have had a long animosity between them, McCain is also not considered a typical Repub. He has voted against his party quite a bit. Thats why he appeals to crossover centrist voters. McCain has had a good rep as a fairly honest politician.

    He's broken with his party on Gay marriage, voted no on the ban. He voted to ban drilling in the Wildlife refuges, criticized Bush for ignoring the Kyoto protocols, voted No on Bush's energy plans, voted yes to limit Presidential powers on ....He has a better voting record on the enviornment than Obama........

    The dems better come up with a something else. Even his position on the war is weak, because the average American doesn't deal with the war on a daily basis. It's something on TV that doesn't touch most lives, and sadly most Americans don't really give a shit about it.

    Just because he's not our candidate doesn't mean we should believe all the Blogger bullshit.....It's as dumb as believing Obama is a secret Muslim that will enslave us all
    It's no longer a dog whistle, it's a fucking trombone


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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by witchcurlgirl View Post
    McCain is not Bush 2. If thats the best smear the dems can come up with......thats sad.

    McCain and Bush have been opposed on numerous issues. They agreed on the war, and McCain understood early on that they were fighting it wrong.
    He agreed on the war, but thought they were fighting it wrong? LOL So he agreed with invading a sovereign, unthreatening nation on lies, but quibbled on how that invasion should have been carried out? Be still my heart.

    They have had a long animosity between them, McCain is also not considered a typical Repub. He has voted against his party quite a bit. Thats why he appeals to crossover centrist voters. McCain has had a good rep as a fairly honest politician.
    Puke. McSame has a stockholm syndrome with Bush, sucking up to him even when Bush kicks him in the face. Fairly honest politician my fat ass. He just projects an image that nobody has really looked hard at. Can we say campaign finance reform/lobbyist lies?

    He's broken with his party on Gay marriage, voted no on the ban.
    He voted no on the federal ban, but wholly supports individual states banning it so fuck that.

    He voted to ban drilling in the Wildlife refuges, criticized Bush for ignoring the Kyoto protocols, voted No on Bush's energy plans, voted yes to limit Presidential powers on ....He has a better voting record on the enviornment than Obama........
    Patently false:

    While McCain has championed legislation to regulate greenhouse gas emissions in his speeches, he hasn't voted for it. And while he's opposed drilling in the Arctic, he also refused to support a ban on drilling in a 2005 defense appropriations bill.

    The article also fails to mention that McCain ranks last among the 535 members of the current Congress in a rating by the League of Conservation Voters.

    McCain has missed every major environmental vote this Congress, according to an analysis by the League. His League lifetime record is just 24 percent. This compares with 86 percent for Obama and 86 percent for Clinton. Obama and Clinton ranked 67 and 73 percent in the League's most recent report.

    "McCain was the only member of Congress to skip every single crucial environmental vote scored by the organization, posting a score lower than Members of Congress who were out for much of the year due to serious illnesses–and even lower than some who died during the term," a release from the Sierra Club noted in February.


    The dems better come up with a something else. Even his position on the war is weak, because the average American doesn't deal with the war on a daily basis. It's something on TV that doesn't touch most lives, and sadly most Americans don't really give a shit about it.
    Well yeah, since Bushy and the Repukes basically censor any images of the war at home, something else McSame never said boo about. Americans need it shoved in their faces.

    Just because he's not our candidate doesn't mean we should believe all the Blogger bullshit.....It's as dumb as believing Obama is a secret Muslim that will enslave us all
    Except one is backed up by fact.
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    Elite Member tkdgirl's Avatar
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    HAHAHAHAHAA, wanna bet?

    A government big enough to give you everything you want,
    is strong enough to take everything you have. ~Thomas Jefferson

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    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grimmlok View Post
    Puke. McSame has a stockholm syndrome with Bush, sucking up to him even when Bush kicks him in the face. Fairly honest politician my fat ass. He just projects an image that nobody has really looked hard at. Can we say campaign finance reform/lobbyist lies?

    He's run for President before, his record is out there, and it's been looked at thoroughly. He has a 25 year record in the Senate to back up that he's not Bush 2......


    Quote Originally Posted by Grimmlok View Post
    He voted no on the federal ban, but wholly supports individual states banning it so fuck that.
    Yes, thats how our system of government works. Any rights not specifically laid out in the Constitution are given over to the States. It's quite a big deal here in America. Maybe you've heard of state's rights?



    As far as the war goes, it was Bush's baby.....but Dems and Repubs voted together on it, and they have voted to fund it. The dems don't have the moral high ground on it. In fact, they ran in 2006 promising to end it....but did fuck all about it. So who's worse? A man who's honest about his support- or a man that claims he's opposed but votes for the funding every single time it comes up for a vote. McCain isn't the only one "projecting an image"


    The League Of Conservation Voters endorsed McCain in 2004's Senate election along with Barack Obama.

    McCain opposed Dick Cheney's 2005 Energy Bill that included huge tax giveaways to oil companies with record revenues. Obama supported the bill.

    Obama did not join McCain and 44 other Republican and Democratic Senators in urging the Environmental Protection Agency to draft stricter Mercury restrictions

    Both Obama and McCain support a cap-and-trade system to phase out greenhouse gas emissions by factories.

    McCain and Obama oppose oil drilling in the Alaskan National Wildlife Refuge. Both voted against it.

    Both candidates support expansion of liquefied coal and ethanol energy technology.

    Obama and McCain have supported expansion of nuclear power plants. Obama switched his position slightly between July 2007 and December 2007, explaining in December that until we can solve the storage and safety issues associated with nuclear power, we should not expand its use.

    Both agree that the U.S. should have signed the Kyoto Treaty.

    I dont really see radical differences here.....

    McCain appeals to the middle......and that's the group that decides elections here in the States....

    In bad times, people go back to the middle.......
    Last edited by witchcurlgirl; May 12th, 2008 at 08:12 PM.
    It's no longer a dog whistle, it's a fucking trombone


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    Elite Member tkdgirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by witchcurlgirl View Post
    He has a 20 year record in the Senate to back up that he's not Bush 2......




    Cause thats how our system of government works. Any rights not specifically laid out in the Constitution are given over to the States. It's quite a big deal here in America.

    As far as the war goes, yes it was Bush's baby.....but Dems and Repubs voted together on it, and they have voted to fund it....The dems don't have the moral high ground on it........In fact, they ran in 2006 promising to end it....but did fuck all about it. So who's worse? A man who's honest about his support- or a man that claims he's opposed but votes for the funding every single time it comes up for a vote. At least McCain tells you up front what his view is.

    The League Of Conservation Voters endorsed McCain in 2004's Senate election along with Barack Obama.

    McCain opposed Dick Cheney's 2005 Energy Bill that included huge tax giveaways to oil companies with record revenues. Obama supported the bill.

    Obama did not join McCain and 44 other Republican and Democratic Senators in urging the Environmental Protection Agency to draft stricter Mercury restrictions

    Both Obama and McCain support a cap-and-trade system to phase out greenhouse gas emissions by factories.

    McCain and Obama oppose oil drilling in the Alaskan National Wildlife Refuge.

    Both candidates support expansion of liquefied coal and ethanol energy technology.

    Obama and McCain have supported expansion of nuclear power plants. Obama switched his position slightly between July 2007 and December 2007, explaining in December that until we can solve the storage and safety issues associated with nuclear power, we should not expand its use.

    Both agree that the U.S. should have signed the Kyoto Treaty.

    I dont really see radical differences here.....

    McCain- like it or not- appeals to the middle......and that's the group that decides elections here in the States....
    Yep, and a ton more 'maverick' positions as well. Any man who seriously considered being John Kerry's VP will not appeal to die hard Republicans or conservatives. McPain may get the middle, but he won't get many of the base.

    Speculation is that he's going to pick Fuckabee as his VP to get the base. Little does he know, the base thinks Fuckabee is a Christian socialist. Like someone said, Reagan could be resurrected and run as McCain's VP- and I still wouldn't vote for him.

    A government big enough to give you everything you want,
    is strong enough to take everything you have. ~Thomas Jefferson

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    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tkdgirl View Post
    Yep, and a ton more 'maverick' positions as well. Any man who seriously considered being John Kerry's VP will not appeal to die hard Republicans or conservatives. McPain may get the middle, but he won't get many of the base.
    Where do you think the base will go in Nov? Paul? Keyes? Barr?

    Just curious about people's opinions....
    It's no longer a dog whistle, it's a fucking trombone


    All of God's children are not beautiful. Most of God's children are, in fact, barely presentable.


    If I wanted the government in my womb I'd fuck a Senator

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    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tkdgirl View Post
    Yep, and a ton more 'maverick' positions as well. Any man who seriously considered being John Kerry's VP will not appeal to die hard Republicans or conservatives. McPain may get the middle, but he won't get many of the base.
    Where do you think the base will go in Nov? Paul? Keyes? Barr? Gravel?

    Just curious about people's opinions....
    It's no longer a dog whistle, it's a fucking trombone


    All of God's children are not beautiful. Most of God's children are, in fact, barely presentable.


    If I wanted the government in my womb I'd fuck a Senator

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    Elite Member tkdgirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by witchcurlgirl View Post
    Where do you think the base will go in Nov? Paul? Keyes? Barr? Gravel?

    Just curious about people's opinions....
    Well, the folks I've talked to, believe it or not, are either willing to sit this one out or vote third party, likely the Constitution Party or even (gasp) libertarian party. I'm not sure what I'm going to do yet either. I will vote, just don't know for who yet.

    McCain has made a lot of enemies in the GOP to the point they'd take Hillary over him. As much as they are disliked, when Rush and Coulter come out against McCain, you know there's something drastically wrong.

    Some are even specing that McCain may make Hillary his VP. Now wouldn't THAT be something? What a convention that would be.

    Personally, McCain needs someone who has a very strong economic background.

    A government big enough to give you everything you want,
    is strong enough to take everything you have. ~Thomas Jefferson

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    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tkdgirl View Post
    Well, the folks I've talked to, believe it or not, are either willing to sit this one out or vote third party, likely the Constitution Party or even (gasp) libertarian party. I'm not sure what I'm going to do yet either. I will vote, just don't know for who yet.

    McCain has made a lot of enemies in the GOP to the point they'd take Hillary over him. As much as they are disliked, when Rush and Coulter come out against McCain, you know there's something drastically wrong.

    Some are even specing that McCain may make Hillary his VP. Now wouldn't THAT be something? What a convention that would be.

    Personally, McCain needs someone who has a very strong economic background.
    It's funny because in NY, with some long time dems I'm seeing a lot of McCain support....Wouldn't it be totally out of order if the repubs voted Third party, and the dems went McCain......talk about a New Order
    It's no longer a dog whistle, it's a fucking trombone


    All of God's children are not beautiful. Most of God's children are, in fact, barely presentable.


    If I wanted the government in my womb I'd fuck a Senator

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    Elite Member tkdgirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by witchcurlgirl View Post
    It's funny because in NY, with some long time dems I'm seeing a lot of McCain support....Wouldn't it be totally out of order if the repubs voted Third party, and the dems went McCain......talk about a New Order
    Well there are many who believe the GOP will divide into two. Hell, the DNC may do that as well. Gonna be interesting come convention time, that's for sure. I'm popping some popcorn!

    A government big enough to give you everything you want,
    is strong enough to take everything you have. ~Thomas Jefferson

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    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tkdgirl View Post
    Well there are many who believe the GOP will divide into two. Hell, the DNC may do that as well. Gonna be interesting come convention time, that's for sure. I'm popping some popcorn!
    It'll be a good thing. No one wants an ice cream parlor where your only choices are chocolate or vanilla.
    It's no longer a dog whistle, it's a fucking trombone


    All of God's children are not beautiful. Most of God's children are, in fact, barely presentable.


    If I wanted the government in my womb I'd fuck a Senator

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    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
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    I think the Republicans are going to get creamed in the next general election. And conservatives who are doing their celebration dance should take into account the fact that the next President will probably get to name two Supreme Court justices. Which will probably push the Court back to the left.

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