General Pace should remember the purple hearts given to gay soldiers.

[Grimmlok]

GEN. PETER PACE, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, yesterday refused to apologize for saying that homosexual acts are "immoral," explaining that he was expressing his "personal moral views." He's entitled to his opinions, of course. But when it comes to shaping public policy, he's obligated to reach a bit higher -- to consider facts and evidence and the impact of his public expressions of intolerance on the men and women he commands.

In response to a question on his views about the "don't ask, don't tell" policy that allows gays and lesbians to serve in the military, but not as openly gay or lesbian, Gen. Pace told the Chicago Tribune on Monday, "I believe homosexual acts between two individuals are immoral and that we should not condone immoral acts. I do not believe the United States is well served by a policy that says it is okay to be immoral in any way."

"Don't ask, don't tell" is the misguided policy instituted in 1993 by President Bill Clinton that deprives the military of able-bodied men and women who want to serve their country. It made no sense in a time of peace. It is absurd in a time of war. One of Gen. Pace's predecessors, retired Army Gen. John Shalikashvili, called for reconsideration of the policy earlier this year.

As the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan have worn on, the Pentagon has had to lower its recruitment standards. "Moral waivers," granted to Army recruits with misdemeanor and felony convictions, nearly doubled between 2003 and 2006. One such recruit, Pvt. Steven D. Green, stands accused of raping a 14-year-old Iraqi girl and murdering her and her family. Meanwhile, the Defense Department purged 11,077 troops -- including 322 desperately needed linguists -- from its ranks between 1994 and 2005 simply because they were gay, although the pace of expulsions seems to have slowed as the military's needs outweighed its moral scruples. Homosexuals serve admirably and openly -- without fear of prosecution or sneering judgment -- in 24 countries, including Israel, Australia and Britain, America's staunchest ally in the Iraq war. Neither morale nor military performance has suffered.

As Gen. Pace considers the uproar over his remarks on morality, he might reflect on Marine Staff Sgt. Eric Fidelis Alva, who like his father and grandfather chose to serve in the military. When he enlisted 17 years ago, he lied about his sexual orientation. Sgt. Alva was the first American wounded in the Iraq war, when he stepped on a land mine. President Bush presented him with the Purple Heart. His moral fitness for duty was unquestioned. What's immoral is that Sgt. Alva -- and thousands of other brave members of the armed forces -- had to lie or be silent for the right, the risk and the honor of serving his country.

The Right to Serve - washingtonpost.com

Frankly, how DARE that asshole call someone who would fight and die for their country, and be a second class citizen unequal to others while doing it, an 'immoral' person.

On a related note, i still say anybody who would fight and die for a country that makes them ride in the back of the bus is a fucking moron, but hey its their choice..

Thirdly, I know why Clinton instituted the 'Don't ask, Don't tell' policy... until that time, witch-hunts for gays in the military took place regularely, and they were summarily cast out when found. The policy had the effect of blunting that, and semi-protecting gays that, for some reason, still wanted to serve. It was an imperfect solution to a horrible problem.

[shedevilang]

I agree with you 100 percent Grimm. I couldn't have put it any better

[lurkur]

Yeah, we have shit like Abu Ghraib happening, but it's gay people that are the immoral ones!! FUCK OFF you ignorant piece of shit!

[xoxo]

Originally Posted by shedevilang

I agree with you 100 percent Grimm. I couldn't have put it any better

same here.

this guy is really the limit, with his absurd comments and ideas..i click threads about him and then i just find myself at a loss..i know people who think like him too and i have to force myself to be polite to them..it is very challenging..

[McJag]

My father was an Army Officer. Never once did I hear him say anything remotely like this jerk. He cared deeply about this country and the men serving under him-their safety,their readyness,their ability to follow and give appropriate orders and so did his fellow officers. I would spend hours listening to them talk as a child,hidden in a corner. Never,ever did I hear one say he cared who his men were sleeping with! That some were gay was taken as a given. That mattered not.
That they were well prepared and honorable meant everything.

[xoxo]

^^cool post mcjag..that seems how it should be...