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Thread: Nothing to hide, nothing to worry about - Orwell's prophetic vision unfolds.

  1. #1
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Thumbs down Nothing to hide, nothing to worry about - Orwell's prophetic vision unfolds.

    "Nothing to hide, nothing to fear"?

    This is a well-crafted and carefully phrased propoganda "viral meme"...

    But let me draw your attention to something slightly more sinister embedded within this phrase.

    In Orwell's 1984, there are the famous "Big Brother is Watching You" posters.

    This phrase is delibrately double-edged.

    For the compliant citizen, the phrase reads as a comfort: "Your loving government, who is like family to you, is looking after you".

    For the rebellious citizen, the phrase reads as a threat: "There is no possible escape from us because we are monitoring everything you do".

    Orwell's point in phrasing the poster's slogan this way was that it was both "carrot" and "stick" simultaneously.

    The "good" citizens would be comforted further into the fascist lies.

    The "bad" citizen would be threatened.

    Now, let us turn our attention to "nothing to hide, nothing to fear".

    Or, substituting the implied words back in:

    "(if you have) nothing to hide (from us, then you have) nothing to fear (from us)"

    Are my fellow "bad" citizens - us "thought criminals" - now able to see the barely veiled "threat" contained therein?

    "If you hide something from us, then you will have something to fear from us"

    Whoever the "spin doctor" was that came up with this "viral meme", they also appear to be a fan of Orwell (or, more probably, a "disciple" of Orwell) and have a very dark and evil sense of humour.

    They couldn't resist "double-edging" this phrase too and also hiding a "threat" for us thought criminals to see.

    Now that you see the "double-edge", it's just as chillingly Orwellian as "Big Brother is Watching You", isn't it?

    Watch all the "compliant citizens" rushing around repeating the "threat" over and over, actually thinking it's a comforting phrase:

    "nothing to hide? nothing to fear!"
    "nothing to hide? nothing to fear!"
    "nothing to hide? nothing to fear!"

    But once we substitute those missing implied words back in:

    "(If you have) nothing to hide (from the government, then you will have) nothing to fear (from the government)"

    The real "threat" meaning becomes obvious:

    "If you hide from us, you should fear us"

    http://forum.no2id.net/viewtopic.php?t=1281&start=40&
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

  2. #2
    Gold Member Delphinium's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nothing to hide, nothing to worry about- Orwell's prophetic vision unfolds.

    The problem with this viewpoint is the average citizen isn't being monitored. This isn't Orwellian at all.

    The wiretapping and bank record monitoring was only focused on those with international calls, accounts linked to known or suspected terrorists overseas etc.

    It isn't like some government rep is going down to the local wells fargo and examining each & every bank account.

    This is a typical example of people blowing things way out of proportion to re-inforce their paranoid world view.

  3. #3
    Elite Member twitchy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nothing to hide, nothing to worry about- Orwell's prophetic vision unfolds.

    When will the "Big Brother is Watching You" posters appear? That would be 2002.

    http://www.art-for-a-change.com/News/eyes.htm

    "The howling backwoods that is IMDB is where film criticism goes to die (and then have its corpse gang-raped, called a racist, and accused of supporting Al-Qaeda)" ----Sean O'Neal, The Onion AV Club

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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nothing to hide, nothing to worry about- Orwell's prophetic vision unfolds.

    The problem with this viewpoint is the average citizen isn't being monitored. This isn't Orwellian at all.
    Again, WRONG WRONG WRONG. Do your research!! hundreds of millions of people's records have been turned over by the major telecoms (google is resisting), the phone record spying is about as in depth. I didn't realize you have hundreds of millions of terrorists communicating with each other in the continental US. The breadth of this thing is not just overseas calls.. they are tapping calls within the US. Hello, this is common knowledge?

    The wiretapping and bank record monitoring was only focused on those with international calls, accounts linked to known or suspected terrorists overseas etc.
    Again, WRONG. DO YOUR RESEARCH. They're even tapping the media to root out confidential sources! Does that sound like a democracy to you? Freedom of the press anybody1?

    It isn't like some government rep is going down to the local wells fargo and examining each & every bank account.
    ... have you even heard of the concept of data mining? Project Echelon, look it up. Gawd!

    This is a typical example of people blowing things way out of proportion to re-inforce their paranoid world view.
    And this is a typical example of trying to argue when not in full posession of the most elementary of facts.
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

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    Gold Member Delphinium's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nothing to hide, nothing to worry about- Orwell's prophetic vision unfolds.

    Oh please Grimm. I for one do NOT want terrorists in America, again, the govt. could check my accounts, and listen to my phone calls ad nauseum, I don't sweat it because I'm not doing things I shouldn't be.

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    Elite Member twitchy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nothing to hide, nothing to worry about- Orwell's prophetic vision unfolds.

    Good little automoton.

    "The howling backwoods that is IMDB is where film criticism goes to die (and then have its corpse gang-raped, called a racist, and accused of supporting Al-Qaeda)" ----Sean O'Neal, The Onion AV Club

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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nothing to hide, nothing to worry about- Orwell's prophetic vision unfolds.

    Quote Originally Posted by Delphinium
    Oh please Grimm. I for one do NOT want terrorists in America, again, the govt. could check my accounts, and listen to my phone calls ad nauseum, I don't sweat it because I'm not doing things I shouldn't be.
    Oh i'm sorry, you just ignored everything i posted. Go back and read it again, and do your research.

    Secondly, you're not an American. No real American would give up their hard won civil rights to some despotic boy-king who is allowed free reign without the proper checks and balances THAT WERE INSTITUTED TO PREVENT WHAT IS HAPPENING NOW.
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

  8. #8
    Gold Member IceQueen's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nothing to hide, nothing to worry about- Orwell's prophetic vision unfolds.

    Quote Originally Posted by Delphinium
    Oh please Grimm. I for one do NOT want terrorists in America, again, the govt. could check my accounts, and listen to my phone calls ad nauseum, I don't sweat it because I'm not doing things I shouldn't be.
    I'm not doing anything I shouldn't be either -except there is NO WAY I want the govt. checking into anything. Once you say that is ok, where does it end? Being that the government is locking up people without giving them access to representation all in the name of protecting us from terrorism, I don't put it past them to fabricate some link in something I may read at the library, or talk to a friend about to fit their cause.

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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nothing to hide, nothing to worry about- Orwell's prophetic vision unfolds.

    Absolute power corrupts absolutely, and the repukes are as corrupt as they get.
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

  10. #10
    Hit By Ban Bus! DirtyPool's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nothing to hide, nothing to worry about- Orwell's prophetic vision unfolds.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimmlok
    Absolute power corrupts absolutely
    What about the Catholic church?

  11. #11
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nothing to hide, nothing to worry about - Orwell's prophetic vision unfolds.

    They're the grand-daddy model all others seem to follow.
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

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