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Thread: Dems dropping 'pre-existing conditions' clause from mangled health bill, loser idiots

  1. #1
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Thumbs down Dems dropping 'pre-existing conditions' clause from mangled health bill, loser idiots

    As Democrats scramble to figure out what to do on health care, there is more evidence, which John first noted earlier, that one of the most popular provisions is on the chopping block:


    Obama has suggested shifting the focus to popular proposals such as banning denial of coverage to those with medical problems. That particular fix is unlikely because it would encourage people to put off getting health insurance until they get sick, driving up the cost of premiums for everybody else.

    "In health care, everything fits together," said Sen. Jay Rockefeller, D-W.Va. "It's very hard to say we can cut this out and do that." Banning pre-existing condition denials would have to go hand-in-hand with coverage for all.


    Hard to imagine how the Democrats can convince the American people that health care has been reformed if insurance companies aren't reined in on the pre-existing conditions issue. Only people living in an out-of-touch bubble would think that's a good political move.

    And, before any policy wonks weigh in with a 10-minute explanation of how these policies are inter-related, let me say, I get that. But, I'm talking about the politics of the issue. The President made it a tenet of his campaign to fix pre-existing conditions. In fact, it was the top item on the website of the transition's plan to "Make Health Insurance Work for People and Businesses -- Not Just Insurance and Drug Companies":


    Require insurance companies to cover pre-existing conditions so all Americans regardless of their health status or history can get comprehensive benefits at fair and stable premiums.

    This is one part of reform that people get -- and expect.

    AMERICAblog News: More evidence that Dems. are seriously consider dropping language on pre-existing conditions
    Yeah, maybe if you chop out ANYTHING that helps people, people will like you. Holy fuck, and I thought Bush was incompetent.. jesus christ
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    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    So one of the big points that apologists keep making for this wreck of a bill is now out.
    It's no longer a dog whistle, it's a fucking trombone


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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Pretty much yeah. Enjoy your forced insurance!
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    Friend of Gossip Rocks! buttmunch's Avatar
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    I've been thinking about this a lot, even though it has no real impact on me. I see that for nigh on nearly a century people have been trying to get some sort of universal health care in the States and the insurance companies, long with others with vested interests, have been remarkably successful in not letting it happen. Finally we have a prez who is trying like hell to make something, anything, happen on this front. It's not going swimmingly or exactly as everyone would like but I'm happy he's at least trying to get something in place. I don't think it's going to be European or Canadian style universal healthcare for a long time to come but I think something will come out of this and it's a step in the right direction. He's cannot just stamp his feet and say 'dammit, I want universal health care and I want it now'. The branches of government don't work that way and lord knows there are enough people out there determined to not have anything happen at all.
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    Elite Member kingcap72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by buttmunch View Post
    I've been thinking about this a lot, even though it has no real impact on me. I see that for nigh on nearly a century people have been trying to get some sort of universal health care in the States and the insurance companies, long with others with vested interests, have been remarkably successful in not letting it happen. Finally we have a prez who is trying like hell to make something, anything, happen on this front. It's not going swimmingly or exactly as everyone would like but I'm happy he's at least trying to get something in place. I don't think it's going to be European or Canadian style universal healthcare for a long time to come but I think something will come out of this and it's a step in the right direction. He's cannot just stamp his feet and say 'dammit, I want universal health care and I want it now'. The branches of government don't work that way and lord knows there are enough people out there determined to not have anything happen at all.
    Agree with everything you said, Butt.

    But if the Dems are going to keep dropping everything, they should just drop the idea of doing any reform period. I know some Dems want to try and shove the Senate bill through before Brown gets sworn in, but that's a bad idea.

    If they break everything up and do it a little at a time, then that could work. But this entire healthcare clusterfuck just gets worse and worse.

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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Oh come on, he's not trying to do something nice.

    If he was, he wouldn't have sold health care down the river by making backroom deals with big pharma which ensured no cheaper drugs from Canada came in, he wouldn't have handed it off to 3 repugs and 3 blue dems who are bought and sold by the industry, he wouldn't have started belittling the public option, he wouldn't have trotted out his spokeswhores to mock anybody who wanted the public option as a "left of the left" fringer (given that 75% of the US public wanted it, that's a lot of fringe), wouldn't have given away everything that was useful to MAYBE get 1 or 2 rethugs on board (which didn't happen), and would have ensured that a mandate that people BUY shitty insurance with no cost controls would not have gone into this bill, wouldn't have thrown women and gays under the bus with the anti-choice amendment and no place to register your same sex partner, and would probably have actually fought for the entire thing instead of sitting back and doing absolutely nothing unless corporate bottom lines were in trouble.

    That is the problem. Not that he's trying hard and failing, it's that what he's trying to do IS AWFUL AND SERVES NOBODY BUT INSURANCE AND PHARMA INDUSTRIES.

    For the love of god.
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    Elite Member Quazar's Avatar
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    After dropping pre-existing conditions, what is actually left in this bill? I'm still trying to figure this out.

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    I was watching Rachel Maddow the other night and she had one of the Senators on and they were talking about how it would actually be better to pass the bill in pieces to force the Republicans' hand. Kind of like, daring them not to vote for

    1) A bill that prevents insurance companies from dropping someone with a serious disease

    2) A bill that prevents insurance companies from denying coverage due to preexisting conditions

    Which I think is basically a good idea, but what worries me is that there is no discussion of price regulation. What good is it if an insurance company keeps you on but jacks your rates so high you can't afford it anymore? Or says, yes, we'll give you a policy but it's going to be $5000/month. Technically they didn't deny you coverage.

    Are they even thinking about these things?

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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Yes, they thought about those things and promptly rejected them.
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    Elite Member Mr. Authority's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quazar View Post
    After dropping pre-existing conditions, what is actually left in this bill? I'm still trying to figure this out.
    Terms to give the insurance companies more profit.

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    Where does it say that the Dems are dropping the "end pre-existing conditions" clause?

    No one has suggested that there will be the mandate without the pre-existing condition clause. Obama has suggested the possibility of having just the pre-existing conditions clause.

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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    re-read the original post.
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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Oops.. looks like it's more likely...

    Joe and I saw this coming two days ago. And unfortunately it's looking increasingly like we were right.

    A day after former Obama campaign manager David Plouffe is elevated to a more senior adviser status at the White House and the DNC, Plouffe pens an op ed in the Washington Post in which he seems to suggest that much of President Obama's promise to ban pre-existing conditions is now being jettisoned. Plouffe wrote in the op ed, which was certainly cleared with the White House, if not written by them:


    Parents won't have to worry their children will be denied coverage just because they have a preexisting condition.


    Their children? The original promise - even the bad Senate bill - protects everyone, of any age, from being denied coverage because of pre-existing conditions. Now it's just children?

    And before anyone argues that Plouffe was simply using children as an example - that the legislation could still cover everyone - look at what else happened in the last two days. CBS News reported that the pre-existing conditions promise was now looking unlikely. But even worse, the NYT talked to folks on the Hill and health policy experts, and they were told the compromise package might just protect kids under the age of 19 from being denied for pre-existing conditions. No one else.

    It would sure be one hell of a coincidence if Plouffe, on behalf of the White House, is now talking about kids being protected from pre-existing conditions when the growing chatter in town is that only kids may now be protected from pre-existing conditions - that the rest of us are about to get tossed under the Martha Coakley bus.

    As Joe noted the other day, the pre-existing conditions promise, for "all Americans," was the top item on the Obama transition's health care reform page. So, in an effort to appease the masses, they're now considering gutting the one provision that everyone likes, the one provision that defines the legislation.

    AMERICAblog News: White House adviser Plouffe fails to mention most of Obama's pre-existing conditions promise right after NYT & CBS report it may be dropped
    uhhuh.
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    At the most you have rumors of rumors.

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    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    I suppose if you try hard enough, wave the pompoms enough, and put your hands over your ears enough you could ignore all the signs.
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

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