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Thread: London Olympics Results *Spoilers*

  1. #46
    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    ^ It's mostly the US freaking. It's happened before in the olympics, to Zamolodchikova, Mohini Bhardwaj, off the top of my head.

    In the heydey of the eastern block nations, many of the best were held from aa by these type rules. They used to scratch girls who made it sometimes, to give another gymnast her slot if they felt she had a better shot at aa gold.
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  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by witchcurlgirl View Post
    ^ It's mostly the US freaking. It's happened before in the olympics, to Zamolodchikova, Mohini Bhardwaj, off the top of my head.

    In the heydey of the eastern block nations, many of the best were held from aa by these type rules. They used to scratch girls who made it sometimes, to give another gymnast her slot if they felt she had a better shot at aa gold.
    I kind of figured that the US was making the biggest stink. Would the "OMG ONLY 2 PPL CAN GO" ruckus be happening, if Weiber beat Douglas?
    Last edited by BoogsBun; July 30th, 2012 at 11:03 AM. Reason: Too many would's in a sentence

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by witchcurlgirl View Post
    The rule may seem silly, but on the other hand people freaked in 2000 when the Romanians swept all 3 aa medals.
    so they changed the rule because of this happening in 2000?
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  4. #49
    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    yes, in the 'interest of fairness'. it was done in 2003, so it would be in effect at athens. they also reduced the total number that go into AA, from the top 36 girls to the top 24. you could once have your top 3 girls, now you can have the top 2.

    it's like how they got rid of perfect 10's and revamped all scoring after athens and the paul hamm controversy. the rules sometimes evolve in response to things like this.

    ETA: the only letting so many gymnasts go forward to aa finals stems from the days when the soviets would have not only swept all the medals, but would have taken 4-7th places in aa as well (teams were larger). it's not fair on it's face, but that's why it's there.
    Last edited by witchcurlgirl; July 30th, 2012 at 12:25 PM.
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  5. #50
    Elite Member Sarzy's Avatar
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    I really didn't expect Britain to get a medal in the men's gymnastics. Bit pissed that we got silver but then the Japanese protested and it was changed to Bronze.

  6. #51
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    They just took GB silver in the gymnastic team event and gave it to Japan...when it looked like Japan finished 4th! Something about Japan not being awarded a point. The crowd was pissed. The Brits were fantastic.

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    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarzy View Post
    I really didn't expect Britain to get a medal in the men's gymnastics. Bit pissed that we got silver but then the Japanese protested and it was changed to Bronze.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fly_On_TheWall View Post
    They just took GB silver in the gymnastic team event and gave it to Japan...when it looked like Japan finished 4th! Something about Japan not being awarded a point. The crowd was pissed. The Brits were fantastic.
    That's kind of ironic. I think it was yesterday, but after initially awarding a Judo win to South Korea, a Japanese coach protested, and they gave the win to Japan.

    Olympic Judo Quarterfinal Ends In Controversy When Initial Loser Is Declared Winner, Both Eventually Win Bronze Anyway

  8. #53
    Elite Member Laurent's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoogsBun View Post
    Would the "OMG ONLY 2 PPL CAN GO" ruckus be happening, if Weiber beat Douglas?
    Wieber is reigning world champion and I think the shock was more that Raisman beat her for the AA than Douglas. I expected Douglas on there, but Raisman was a little bit of a surprise.

    I get why they only allow the top two to keep it fair in the long run, and if Wieber hadn't fallen short, I doubt she would be squawking on Raisman's behalf. It's just all this shock for the U.S. that the world champion isn't going to the AA, but that's how it turned out. That said, I do think Wieber was underscored a bit.
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    Elite Member JadeStar70's Avatar
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    Can someone explain to me why Gabby did beat Jordyn when she stepped WAY out of bounds and took several steps? Jordyn didn't step out to far, and just one foot, if I remember right. I don't know all the ins and outs of this sport, but to me, it seemed like Gabby did worse on that event.

  10. #55
    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
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    Doulglas had huge scores on her other three events, which made up for her floor error in her total aa score. Jordyn had a break on bars, her beam had some bobbles, and she stepped out on floor. No room for that many errors at this level, they add up fast.

    Douglas did beat Wieber at the olympic trials last month, so this result isn't really that out of left field.
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    Elite Member angelais's Avatar
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    I think the U.S. men's team ended up 5th in the team competition. Oh well....
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    Elite Member angelais's Avatar
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    I also just read that Grevers from the U.S. scored gold in the 100 meter back stroke and another guy from the U.S., last name Thoman, won the silver. Awesome!!
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    Elite Member JadeStar70's Avatar
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    Okay,..thank you, witchcurlgirl. That makes sense. I was so afraid that Gabby had really buggered it up with that mistake on the floor exercise.

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    Gold Member laynes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by angelais View Post
    I also just read that Grevers from the U.S. scored gold in the 100 meter back stroke and another guy from the U.S., last name Thoman, won the silver. Awesome!!
    Yay Thoman! He's from my hometown..how exciting.

    I hate the way the Gymnasts qualify. The top 24 should get in period. The Olympics is about the best of the best. Isn't that how they do swimming and track? The fastest get in, no matter if one or ten are from one country.



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    Elite Member OrangeSlice's Avatar
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    I thought this was an interesting article about the whole Wieber debate:

    Blame the sport, not the 'dumb' rule, for Jordyn Wieber's absence from Olympic all-around final - Yahoo! Sports

    Blame the sport, not the 'dumb' rule, for Jordyn Wieber's absence from Olympic all-around final




    LONDON – The idea of having an Olympic final featuring 24 athletes, but not the world's fourth-best qualifier and reigning world champion is, at first look, an assault to the senses. That's what will happen later this week in the women's gymnastics all-around after Jordyn Wieber finished fourth in qualifying but third among Americans.
    Since the Federation of International Gymnastics caps participation in the finals at two per country, Wieber was out. The rule has been decried relentlessly since. Wieber's coach John Geddert deemed it, "dumb."
    Perhaps it is, but an improved system isn't nearly as obvious or as smart as you'd think.
    First, this is pretty much how every other Olympic competition operates. It's a way to promote various sports across the globe. Only the top two swimmers and top three runners from any given country can qualify for an Olympic race.
    It's just those are hashed out at the lower profile national qualifying meets, not within the structure of the Olympics, as gymnastics handles it. The Olympics have long ago determined that it would rather have a global competition than, say, a swim meet featuring a preponderance of athletes from three or four countries.
    The United States could probably field a dozen men's basketball teams better than Tunisia. That isn't how anyone views the Olympics. So we choose one (we could have a tourney of contending squads if we wanted) and call it our team.

    "That's just how we do it," said Martha Karolyi, the director of the U.S. gymnastics team. "It is very difficult, but that is it."
    There's more to it. While gymnastics is arguably the most pressure-packed competition of the Olympics featuring gifted, dedicated, and mentally tough athletes, it isn't a sport in the traditional sense.
    It is a competition. It relies on subjective decisions, not objective measures. A swimmer must touch the wall ahead of the others. An arrow must strike near the bull's-eye more often. A distance runner must finish ahead of the pack.
    Since you can't have a pool big enough for hundreds to race in at the same time, a clock is used in some trials. A clock is not subjective like a judge.
    Gymnastics (and diving and figure skating and other competitions) is different. It relies on humans to decide who did the best routine. They attempt to quantify things as best as possible, but in the end it's their eyes and mind that determine the winner.
    The byproduct, at least in women's gymnastics, includes athletes wearing make up and sparkly outfits in an effort to influence the judges. It's hard to be ugly and be a champion gymnast. No one cares what Usain Bolt looks like.
    Wieber, if anything, was likely penalized for being more powerfully built than some other gymnasts since Olympic judges have long seemed to favor lean, lithe competitors. It's what Shawn Johnson's camp complained about four years ago.
    Geddert railed about the officiating after, claiming Wieber didn't get "the scores she normally does. She got nothing tonight." He may be right. That's gymnastics, though.
    And that's where the national limit comes into play. Judges also have the human tendency to have scores rise as the competition gets better. One great performance tends to impact the next – whether that routine is better or not.
    Bela Karolyi, whose been around the sport for decades and is Martha's husband, wondered if Wieber was affected by the order of competitors in the floor exercise, the U.S. team's final discipline.
    Wieber went third. Aly Raisman, who unexpectedly finished first among the Americans and thus knocked Wieber out of the all-around, went directly after her. Karolyi noted that judges' scores generally go up and had the places been reversed perhaps the results would have, too.
    Again, that's gymnastics. That will always be gymnastics.
    Now, the problem with giving too many slots to one country is that it can further cloud judge's scores. Being a member of a great team means you are surrounded by other great gymnasts and thus have an advantage.
    Weaker members of a stronger team could have their scores artificially boosted because of whom they follow. Meanwhile, a competitor from a developing program or nontraditional nation, who might have competed in a morning qualifying session in a half-full arena lacking energy, atmosphere, and comparative greatness, might suffer.
    The whole thing is a mess and everyone knows it. USA Gymnastics holds a national trials to determine its Olympic team. Except it doesn't really. It's a made-for-TV program. While there is judging, only the top two scorers (after meeting certain scoring qualifications) get an automatic spot on the team. A committee chooses the other spots because everyone agrees that judging is inherently flawed.
    So fine, the two-athlete-per nation rule may be the worst system in the world. Well, except for all the other systems.
    It's tough for Wieber, who dreamed big. She will still compete for a team title and individually in floor exercise. In the end, she was done in by her sport.
    Gymnastics is gymnastics. Just enjoy the show because no one ever knows who really had the best performance.
    They hand out a gold medal anyway.
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