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Thread: Arab nations want UN resolution banning "slandering" of religion

  1. #76
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    Default Re: Arab nations want UN resolution banning "slandering" of religion

    Quote Originally Posted by MrsDark
    Mohammed not a pedophile? So is this stuff BS then? http://www.answering-islam.org/Silas/childbrides.htm
    That website is B.S. It is a Muslim bashing site made by Christian fundamentalists.It is filled with anti-Muslim and anti-Islam rhetoric. And how does it make sense to go to Christian fundamentalists who have an anti-Muslim agenda for information on Islam?

    If you want a good,reliable answer,you can go here...
    http://www.guidedones.com/metapage/frq/Aisha.htm

    Quote Originally Posted by Sojiita
    um..you do realize I was basically agreeing with Grimmlok. And I agree it was not just Mohammed...there were probably alot of men back then(andin other cultures) who I would have to put in the same class.
    Oops,I guess I read your posts in the wrong way then...

    Well,I just guess we'll agree to disagree....That is how it was in some cultures back then and you cannot compare it and set it to today's standards. I just do not get some are so quick to call Prophet Mohammed a "pedophile" which is quite vile.He was not a sexual predator who preyed on little girls. When he was 25, he married Khadijah who was 45 and his first wife.


    My great great grandfather was 63 and he married a 13 year old. He was not considered a pedophile because back then, it was normal and seen as acceptable for older men in their senior to marry young girls. This stuff even happened in the middle ages and before and YOU probably have ancestors where older men in their senior years married young girls. Yes, by today's standards that is sickening,but back then that is just how it was and it was seen as the norm and it was the custom. Times change.

    What really gets me about Islam(and the part that is so hard to comprehend) is how it can be so fanatical, in that just making a cartoon about Mohammed would be so offensive that people would want to kill over it. I know there are other crazies in other religions, but it just seems so extreme right now with Islam. this is the kind of thing I would expect from Christianity several hundred years ago. Even the worst Christian fundies here would not go that far about a more offensive cartoon about Jesus(Although it may get there yet the way things are going here). It just seems to be such a blind, ignorant and narrowminded faith that some Muslims have. It is very threatening and alarming to people of other faiths, and to non-believers as well.
    You know what,as a Muslim I agree with you...I even get offended by those who call for death upon anyone just because someone drew the Prophet in a demeaning manner. Even,me,as a Muslim can never fully grasp it.

    Even though in Islam, there is NO mentioning of forbidding drawings of the Prophet Mohammed whether good or bad or even talking of killing those who do.

    But you see, they see it differently, so you would not understand WHY they think that way. I understand WHY even though I condemn it. It is just the way they have those set of beliefs and the way they made it to be. That is what is embedded in their heads.You have to understand to how much of an extent they identify with Prophet Mohammed. That is how much it gets to them.

    People in the Middle East lived in an enclosed society where there is corrupted laws and under dictatorship regimes. So those people if they were EVER to come here,in the West,they would never ever dare call death upon anyone who drew the Prophet in a demeaning way, and they would approach it in a peaceful manner like the Muslims in the West did because they start to see things in a different context. But when you live in improverished conditions, an enclosed society and live in misery with so much anger, rage will come out in the worst ways when you let these things get the best of you.

  2. #77
    Gold Member Karizma's Avatar
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    Default Re: Arab nations want UN resolution banning "slandering" of religion

    I suppose it's just coincidental that the majority of the countries with the highest and most horrific incidences of human rights violations, specifically in regard to women and children, are countries where not only ISLAM is the most widely practiced religion, but where religion and government are intertwined to the point where the laws that govern ALL (or at least those not in power, which would be women to an even greater extent than men) supposedly come almost directly from the religious texts? How many websites do you want links to that involve specific, detailed and graphic descriptions? Websites that don't even care about religion, just saving lives. Where what is mentioned by the victims in their testimonies is the only reference to religion (not surprisingly).
    whoa whoa..wait a sec here. Countries with most human rights violations, if i am not mistaken are US, Russia and China. NONE are Muslim.

    directly from religious texts? hmm post them then. Its not hard to live in a democratic country like yours and yet dont have access to these texts.

    post as much links as you want to support your argument. But next time refrain using islamophobic webpages, you can always rely on Human Righst Watch, Amnesty, ICC or other "valuable" sites.

    If some of these violations have nothing to do with the Muslim faith but cultural practices that exist outside of it, then Kaz you should be the first one protesting these *bad* Muslims who claim to be following the laws of ISLAM as they are meant to be interpreted, not online calling someone you don't even know a hater and implying I have some sort of unfair prejudice towards Muslims.
    Check my posts and tell me where i defended the *bad* Muslims. But if you are here going to blame MY religion, you've got to post something that support your argument not just some bullshit ranting about Islam is this and that because it happens in one country or another. Reality checks, customs and traditions play bigger roles than religion.

    Yes i will call ANYONE who INTENTIONALLY post twisted lies about Islam a hater, online or not. When someone tries to smitten my religion REGARDLESS of his/her religion, i won't be apologistic and silent about it, like it or not. I call Osama a hater, Al-Zarqawi a hater and all their likes. Its not limited down to "non-Muslims".

    When you judge a whole kind and stigmatize it, then yes you have unfair pre-judice towards it. After all the Nazis started with their Holocaust not by killing but by fueling the fire, by brainwashing Germans with nasty "facts" about the Jews and when their execustion started, the entire public didnt sympathize with them because they were already clouded with their own perception.

    And if you're trying to get me to buy that what is happening to women and children EVERY DAY in these countries under religious rule has nothing to do with religion....yes your religion...well, it's just not gonna happen.
    What do you think will happen instead? You convincing me and other Muslims, that Islam is "violent" religion, that Islam is "anti-humanity" religion? That Islam has spread through "blood and sword" that's why its the fastest growing religion in US -democratic nation-!? Do you really think by your ranting you will change our conviction or even raise questions??!! Your likes have always been existed through centuries and they will always exist and your exitance never threatened our belief.

    Does it mean I think all Muslims condone these things? No. Maybe your religion as you understand it does not condone what others do. But don't sit here defending it to me like I'm the little bigoted ignoramus who has it all wrong. Your fellow Muslims do.
    My fellow Muslims are 1.3 billion people, so did all these masses annoyed you already??

    You know i have already condemned what my *fellow* Muslims like Osama and those who share his idealogy, i already called them criminals and barbaric assholes. I alreay condemned their means and their haterd. I already condemned those who torched down the embassies and threatened to kill people or harm properties...But no, you want me to condemn Islam and Prophet Muhammed (PBUH), dont you? so yes, you are a little bigoted ignoramus who has it all wrong, dont even try to convince me otherwise and hence i will continue to defend my belief.

    Don't even try to lecture me about Islam, not only that you dont follow it but you obviously full of haterd towards it. I know Islam because I'm Muslim, and my views arent only shared by myself but my millions. You dont even have strong supports to your argument, if you want to blame the religion posts verses from Quran. Dont post some bullshit fictional stories generated by Islamophobics? how can we even take your points seriously when you dont even care about how you present your ideas?

    Its funny how my previous post explanating the cultural differences between countries was never responded to. If you were really looking for objective debate you would've paied attention to what i mentioned about counties so close like UAE and Saudi Arabia and yet have vast difference in their laws; about how tribes in Africa indulge Qur'an with black magic!; about female circumcision; and honor killing. I could even discuss the 'gang-rape' in Pakistan and 'Quran marriage' and many other nasty CUSTOMS. But no, you are only interested in posting your opinions without any facts, in me giving up and say 'hell you are right, Islam is truely uncivilized religion. its the cause of ALL world problems and evil-doings".

    Dig alittle depper and understand that traditions and re-interpretations of verses are the MAIN problem here, not Islam or any other religion for that matter. Religions can be pacifier at best and war-preacher at worst, it ALL depends on the mentality of some its followers and their idealogies.

    And for the record, I'm an equal opportunity *hater* when it comes to religion. So the deflection by bringing up what the Jews and and the Christians and or the Shintoists or the Druids, etc, etc...have done in the name of their god/s throughout history has no effect here. I know they suck too.
    wow they suck too but you only post about Islam. I will be interested to see you posting links, similar to the one you posted, about Christianity, Judaism, Buddhism and so on, cuz "they suck too", let's see.

    And I'm sure plenty of their prophets were whoremongering polygamist pedophiles too, as they're only human. I care about people, not religion. And where there's an excess of religion, there is always an excess of suffering and human rights (specifically in regard to women and children) violations. Period. Coincidence? I think not.
    Your lack of respect to Prophets, God or anything sacred led you to think of them as whoremongering pedophiles. If you had respect for them, you wouldnt believe the lies about them, but you only believe what you want to believe and to me you already made-up your mind about hating anything scared and attaching all the negativity to it.

    By the way i thought China is a GODLESS nation, so were/are Khmer Rouge, Stalin and Kim II-sung who are hardcore athiests. Yet they are reponsible of crimes against humanity and violations to human rights? surprising no. So all athiests are violent people? Yes, where God plays no role in your heart, you have no heart at all. You see just like you i made some point based on some facts happening somewhere, and demonized millions of poeple.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimmlok
    So yeah, if these young girls were shoved into that kind of marriage and it was consummated at that age.. that's pedophilia, and well.. your prophet was a pedophile. That's just kinda how it is.
    Don't worry no one was shoved into that kind of marriage and it was not consummated at that age. Aisha's age is still in question, she is reported to be from 9-20. Elise has posted the article about it.

    As Hazeleyed_Honey said, 1400 years ago things were not interpreted the way it is now. Like it or not, just like you dont expect the laws of ancient to be applied nowadays, the laws of nowadays dont apply for the ancient. Every time has it owns laws, rules and understanding.
    Last edited by Karizma; March 10th, 2006 at 01:05 PM.

  3. #78
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    Default Re: Arab nations want UN resolution banning "slandering" of religion

    Yes,that is the main thing about religion.....It is ALL about interpretation. It is not the religions themselves that are the problem, it is how they are interpreted and how people twist them and distort them for their own agendas.THAT is the problem.

    I am not a fully practicing Muslim as that I do things which are considered sinful, I do not pray 5 times a day but then again, the way I interpret the Qur'an than so different than any other Muslim would. How I see it, the relationship between God and I is only between me and Him,and no one can interfere in it. It is a private spiritual connection for me and who is anyone to judge me how much of a Muslim I am?That is God's job to judge me for that and no one else. As for the Qur'an,I approach it in such an openminded and liberal manner. So my interpretations of some Qur'an are completely different than how these radical fundamentalists twist and distort them.

    Thus,the problem is not with Islam the religion itself, it is with the Islamic culture that us Islamic followers have made it into.

  4. #79
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Arab nations want UN resolution banning "slandering" of religion

    Religion, being a human construct, is inherently flawed and imperfect. Anybody claiming otherwise is nuts.
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

  5. #80
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Arab nations want UN resolution banning "slandering" of religion

    Don't worry no one was shoved into that kind of marriage and it was not consummated at that age.
    LOL that happens even today! That was a silly statement.
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

  6. #81
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    Default Re: Arab nations want UN resolution banning "slandering" of religion

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimmlok
    Religion, being a human construct, is inherently flawed and imperfect. Anybody claiming otherwise is nuts.
    To you it is...but to others who believe in religions, they see it as God's words ad not as human construct and it is perfect to them.

  7. #82
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Arab nations want UN resolution banning "slandering" of religion

    Anything written down or passed orally is an interpretation of what God said, and thus since it has passed through human hands it is flawed. We are not perfect creatures.. if we were, we would BE god.
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

  8. #83
    Gold Member Karizma's Avatar
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    Default Re: Arab nations want UN resolution banning "slandering" of religion

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimmlok
    LOL that happens even today! That was a silly statement.
    I was refering to Aisha since she was the one who brought up the whole pedophile debate.

  9. #84
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Arab nations want UN resolution banning "slandering" of religion

    Yes, but none of us were actually there, so who knows what went on. For all we know, there were clowns.

    CLOWNS.
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

  10. #85
    Silver Member snakebread's Avatar
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    Default Re: Arab nations want UN resolution banning "slandering" of religion

    Ok, I still can't get past the fact that you all believe in some weird fantasy fairy-tale bullsh*t about some afterlife crap.

    And, in the case of Islam, lots of transluscent virgins with ruby-colored bone marrow. WE ARE (supposedly) INTELLIGENT ADULTS. We don't need to believe in Santa anymore.

    And that includes Tom Cruise, a blasphemy upon the celebrity sphere.

  11. #86
    Elite Member Sojiita's Avatar
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    Default Re: Arab nations want UN resolution banning "slandering" of religion

    If it has not been posted already, here is the caricature/cartoon that seemed to be 'the most offensive'. Judge for yourself, and long live freedom of speech and expression.


    here is a Bush and Jesus one thrown in for fun.
    Last edited by Sojiita; April 16th, 2006 at 03:59 AM.
    Don't slap me, cause I'm not in the mood!

  12. #87
    Gold Member Karizma's Avatar
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    Default Re: Arab nations want UN resolution banning "slandering" of religion

    Yes i've seen and i happen to agree that it's offensive, rude, Islamophobic and distasteful. Boycott is the best retaliation.

  13. #88
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
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    Default Re: Arab nations want UN resolution banning "slandering" of religion

    *shrug*

    They seem fine to me... the artistry isn't the best on the mohammed one, but the jesus one really 'nails' it.
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

  14. #89
    Silver Member snakebread's Avatar
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    Default Re: Arab nations want UN resolution banning "slandering" of religion

    NAILS, oh I love this man.

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