Bin row sparks bid to woo public

[DisruptiveHair]

I'm so glad I'm not the only one furious with this new development. The green waste bins are not very useful for us because we already compost most of our garden waste anyway and our bin is full every week. The recycling bin we are provided only accepts glass, cans, and paper, whereas most of the recyclable waste we have is plastic and cardboard from the hideously over-packaged food all of our local supermarkets carry. The recycling bin is also too small to hold a fortnight's worth of glass, cans, and paper.

The public was not consulted about this at all; the new rules came as a shock to everyone in this neighborhood and just in the last month, fly-tipping has increased dramatically. The few public bins around here are overflowing with bagged garbage placed there by residents, and there is trash all over the ground in the neighborhood, either dropped there by idiots or blown there from overflowing garbage bins. It's an outrage. I support recycling, but this new system has left us twisting in the wind.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/n...re/4334156.stm

Confusion over a council's new bin-emptying policy has forced it to despatch officers across the city to explain the new system.
For weeks now residents in York have been adjusting to having their household waste collected on a fortnightly rather than weekly basis.

Now the Lib Dem council is sending officers to ward meetings to explain how the system should work.

But the Labour opposition said the move was "too little, too late".

Under the scheme grey bins containing household waste are collected one week and green bins containing waste for recycling the following week.

But the move has led to rising complaints about overflowing bins and confusion about which dates the green or grey bins would be emptied.

Opposition Labour councillor Ruth Potter said: "It isn't much use giving residents more information about the new system now when residents have been struggling to deal with fortnightly collections for weeks already.

"This is all too little, too late.

"This should have been discussed with residents not only before the scheme was introduced, but before the council even decided on the scheme, but consultation and forethought are alien concepts to this council."

Kristy Walton, head of the council's waste strategy countered the claim and said: "We've been really encouraged by how well residents have cooperated with the new arrangements.

"We know that it will take a while for everyone to get used to the fortnightly system and recognise that there have been some teething problems."

[UndercoverGator]

I don't understand why they didn't do just what our area did when they made some major changes to the refuse collection services. They sent around nice new official bins with registered numbers on them along with a nice pamplet explaining all of the changes, right down to when recycling would be picked up and what days it was refuse only. People complained at first a little bit but eventually everyone realized they had to consult the paperwork.

They cut the number of times garbage was collected in half here too but gave everyone the option of purchasing an additional refuse container and paying for the additional pickup as well. You can throw out more stuff if you're willing to pay the price. But it sounds like the real difference is that the official bins we were given are nearly twice as big as a bin you can buy at the hardware store. They should have issued bigger bins.

[DisruptiveHair]

Originally Posted by UndercoverGator

I don't understand why they didn't do just what our area did when they made some major changes to the refuse collection services. They sent around nice new official bins with registered numbers on them along with a nice pamplet explaining all of the changes, right down to when recycling would be picked up and what days it was refuse only. People complained at first a little bit but eventually everyone realized they had to consult the paperwork.

They cut the number of times garbage was collected in half here too but gave everyone the option of purchasing an additional refuse container and paying for the additional pickup as well. You can throw out more stuff if you're willing to pay the price. But it sounds like the real difference is that the official bins we were given are nearly twice as big as a bin you can buy at the hardware store. They should have issued bigger bins.

As it is, the bins we get are tiny. When we were visiting my old college roommate in Austin, we were shocked by the size of her bin. Not only was it three times the size of ours, she said it was collected twice a week. My parents have two large bins that are collected twice a week (in Dallas) and they were shocked at how small the garbage bins are here. I was shocked at first too, but I've gotten used to it.

We do our best to avoid over-packaged foods, but it's so damned hard when even individual vegetables often come shrink-wrapped or only a few to a plastic bag. I remember in supermarkets in Texas, you could get a bunch of spinach tied up with a rubber band; that's HOW IT CAME. Here, we can only ever find the washed and trimmed stuff in a non-recyclable plastic bag. Broccoli, cauliflower, cabbage, cucumbers, heads of lettuce, etc. almost always come individually shrink-wrapped. I've even seen bell peppers individually shrink-wrapped. Chilis often come in little plastic bags, 3-4 chilis per bag. Tomatos usually come in plastic punnets, radishes are always in plastic bags, baking potatos often come four to a plastic and styrofoam package, salad potatos are almost ALWAYS in plastic bags...etc. That shit adds up. Meat ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS comes in plastic trays. It is infuriating. I remember when meat came in wax paper.

[IceQueen]

I'm confused why this is such a big issue. The recycling team comes once a week for us in the Pac NW (Portland)- and the city is fairly clean and we do recycle a lot. Rather than rely on the bucket they gave, most people set up a recycle center on the porch or the garage. Is recycling a big issue for your community, or just you? The reason I ask is because in order for recycling to work right, everyone has to be just as committed. Does your neighborhood have drop offs or retailers participate in the using of reused bags and save some $$?

[DisruptiveHair]

Originally Posted by IceQueen

I'm confused why this is such a big issue. The recycling team comes once a week for us in the Pac NW (Portland)- and the city is fairly clean and we do recycle a lot. Rather than rely on the bucket they gave, most people set up a recycle center on the porch or the garage. Is recycling a big issue for your community, or just you? The reason I ask is because in order for recycling to work right, everyone has to be just as committed. Does your neighborhood have drop offs or retailers participate in the using of reused bags and save some $$?

Currently, there are not many places in the city where you can drop off recycling, curbside recycling pickup is not 100% and the areas that do have it have very small recycling bins that aren't large enough, and if you have recyclables but no car, you're basically fucked unless you want to take your trash with you on the bus or call a taxi.

This is why we've been left twisting; we've had our trash collection cut by 50% and have been provided with nothing extra to take up the slack (and a green waste bin doesn't fucking count; green waste accounts for very little of our trash)...no extra recycling pickups, no larger recycling bins, no expansion of the recyclables they will pick up. The green bin is a cop-out anyway; the council already composts, and picking up and composting green waste was by far the cheapest option, since all they do with it is stack it to let it rot, then sell it back to us.

[Lil]

Originally Posted by disruptivehair

When we were visiting my old college roommate in Austin, we were shocked by the size of her bin. Not only was it three times the size of ours, she said it was collected twice a week. My parents have two large bins that are collected twice a week (in Dallas) and they were shocked at how small the garbage bins are here.

We do our best to avoid over-packaged foods, but it's so damned hard when even individual vegetables often come shrink-wrapped or only a few to a plastic bag. I remember in supermarkets in Texas, you could get a bunch of spinach tied up with a rubber band; that's HOW IT CAME. Here, we can only ever find the washed and trimmed stuff in a non-recyclable plastic bag. Broccoli, cauliflower, cabbage, cucumbers, heads of lettuce, etc. almost always come individually shrink-wrapped. I've even seen bell peppers individually shrink-wrapped. Chilis often come in little plastic bags, 3-4 chilis per bag. Tomatos usually come in plastic punnets, radishes are always in plastic bags, baking potatos often come four to a plastic and styrofoam package, salad potatos are almost ALWAYS in plastic bags...etc. That shit adds up.

So the bins are much bigger and emptied twice as often but there is less packaging to throw away? That doesn't make sense does it, the bins must be virtually empty when the binmen come.

Our recycling scheme is similar to yours, but works OK, on the whole. The normal grey wheelie bin is collected every alternate week (this can be a pain sometimes, it gets full quite quickly), and on the other week they collect the green wheelie bin (garden waste - our problem is that we have a large garden and could fill several of them every week with grass cuttings), the cans and plastic bottles and the papers and magazines. I wish they'd take glass too, but otherwise I am happy with it. There are recycling facilities at the supermarket, but I was generally too disorganised to take stuff, so we are now recycling much more than we did before the scheme was introduced.

[DisruptiveHair]

Originally Posted by Lil

So the bins are much bigger and emptied twice as often but there is less packaging to throw away? That doesn't make sense does it, the bins must be virtually empty when the binmen come.

Actually, one day that we were in Austin my friend didn't put her bin out because there was only one bag of garbage in there; she didn't see the point of having it emptied. She says it's never full when it's emptied.

Our recycling scheme is similar to yours, but works OK, on the whole. The normal grey wheelie bin is collected every alternate week (this can be a pain sometimes, it gets full quite quickly), and on the other week they collect the green wheelie bin (garden waste - our problem is that we have a large garden and could fill several of them every week with grass cuttings), the cans and plastic bottles and the papers and magazines. I wish they'd take glass too, but otherwise I am happy with it. There are recycling facilities at the supermarket, but I was generally too disorganised to take stuff, so we are now recycling much more than we did before the scheme was introduced.

See, things would be better if they took plastic instead of glass, since most of the overpackaging of food here consists of plastic instead of glass, and we don't tend to buy things in jars anyway. We have such a tiny garden anyway and we compost, so we rarely have very much green waste to throw away and when we have, we've just taken it to the city dump and put it with the green waste. We also have to trek out there about once a month and sort out the recycling that the city won't pick up, which is so much FUN. We're supposed to get a skip for plastics at the local supermarket but they haven't put it in yet. You can recycle paper, aluminum, and glass there, but not cardboard, and a lot of the plastic that food is packaged in isn't recyclable anyway. I think they ought to pass a law requiring all plastic to be recyclable. I'm sick of all the waste.

[UndercoverGator]

Originally Posted by disruptivehair

As it is, the bins we get are tiny. When we were visiting my old college roommate in Austin, we were shocked by the size of her bin. Not only was it three times the size of ours, she said it was collected twice a week. My parents have two large bins that are collected twice a week (in Dallas) and they were shocked at how small the garbage bins are here. I was shocked at first too, but I've gotten used to it.

We do our best to avoid over-packaged foods, but it's so damned hard when even individual vegetables often come shrink-wrapped or only a few to a plastic bag. I remember in supermarkets in Texas, you could get a bunch of spinach tied up with a rubber band; that's HOW IT CAME. Here, we can only ever find the washed and trimmed stuff in a non-recyclable plastic bag. Broccoli, cauliflower, cabbage, cucumbers, heads of lettuce, etc. almost always come individually shrink-wrapped. I've even seen bell peppers individually shrink-wrapped. Chilis often come in little plastic bags, 3-4 chilis per bag. Tomatos usually come in plastic punnets, radishes are always in plastic bags, baking potatos often come four to a plastic and styrofoam package, salad potatos are almost ALWAYS in plastic bags...etc. That shit adds up. Meat ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS comes in plastic trays. It is infuriating. I remember when meat came in wax paper.

That over packaging drives me mad and it's another reason I primarily shop at Whole Foods and the Mennonite store by the house. You get things in bulk with just the most minimal wrapping. I wish American and British food companies would adopt miminal packaging. When I lived in Germany many things came minimally wrapped. It makes a huge difference in how much trash you have.

The other place I shop for food a lot has the too much packaging problem, Sams Club. Too many things are multi packs shoved into huge packs meaning you have twice the wrapping to dispose of. I'd love to not shop there but with a 17 year old boy that eats like a mule with a hole in his stomach it's not an option right now.

[DisruptiveHair]

Originally Posted by UndercoverGator

That over packaging drives me mad and it's another reason I primarily shop at Whole Foods and the Mennonite store by the house. You get things in bulk with just the most minimal wrapping. I wish American and British food companies would adopt miminal packaging. When I lived in Germany many things came minimally wrapped. It makes a huge difference in how much trash you have.

The other place I shop for food a lot has the too much packaging problem, Sams Club. Too many things are multi packs shoved into huge packs meaning you have twice the wrapping to dispose of. I'd love to not shop there but with a 17 year old boy that eats like a mule with a hole in his stomach it's not an option right now.

Food here is so overpackaged it's INSANE. Check this out:



This is 20g of dill in a plastic tray, completely wrapped up in plastic. It is INSANE. Previously, Sainsbury's sold their fresh herbs in little triangular plastic packets...still not ideal, but much less wasteful than THIS. ALL of their small herb bouquets are now sold this way. Some larger bouquets are still packaged in the plastic triangular bags, and potted herbs are still swathed in plastic wrapping too.

We no longer buy fresh herbs from Sainsbury's. We just can't justify it...and now that they're only emptying our bins every other week, we don't have the space anyway.

I've lived in the US and the UK, and I have to say that the UK is worse for overpackaging food. You get the same packaging here for processed food that you get in the US, but here produce is much more likely to be shrink-wrapped, wrapped in plastic bags, sold in plastic trays, etc. There are many items of produce that you cannot buy loose at ALL at any major supermarket in this city, and they include:

lettuce
cabbage
baby ANYTHING
cucumbers
cherry tomatos
soft fruit of any kind (cherries, raspberries, strawberries, etc, all come in 2x as much plastic as they ever did in Texas)
stone fruit of any kind (plums, peaches, etc)
spinach
chard
endives
radishes
spring onions (scallions)
chili peppers
physalis (cape gooseberries)
beefsteak tomatos
herbs of any kind (thyme, cilantro, mint, parsley, etc)
unusual varieties of any fruit or vegetable (purple carrots, baby turnips, tigerella tomatos, etc)
broccoli
cauliflower
celery

You can still buy potatos, carrots, parsnips, leeks, onions, rutabaga, tomatos, apples, oranges, and bananas loose pretty easily, but even those items are sometimes swaddled in plastic.

I visited an HEB in Austin in March and the vast majority of items in the produce department were loose and not in packaging of any kind, allowing you to more easily select exactly what you want. That's the way it should be, and that ain't how it is in supermarkets here. Marks and Spencer is even worse for overpackaging; not only are most things swaddled in plastic, but many items are already washed, diced, or sliced for you, making them more expensive since "value" has been "added." Waitrose is also terrible for that. Tesco and Asda are less likely to overpackage food than Sainsbury's is, but they're only SLIGHTLY less likely.

[Lil]

Did you read the recent stuff about the amount of chlorine in the water they wash the prepared salads in DH? Made me stop buying them.

[DisruptiveHair]

Originally Posted by Lil

Did you read the recent stuff about the amount of chlorine in the water they wash the prepared salads in DH? Made me stop buying them.

Yeah, it's nasty. I rarely buy prepared salads anyway because they're overpriced, but sometimes it's the only way I can get my hands on chard or spinach.