Parents blamed for unruly pupils

DisruptiveHair · October 11th, 2005, 08:14 AM

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/4327670.stm

Quote:

Parents are the biggest factor in the disruptive behaviour of school pupils, say teachers.

A survey of 500 primary and secondary teachers for the Teachers' TV channel found 80% blamed discipline problems at school on a lack of parental control.

Almost three quarters of those asked said they would support a tough "zero tolerance" approach to bad behaviour.

And a majority wanted the parents of excluded children to have to stay at home to look after them.

The survey, published ahead of a report from the government's working group examining problems with classroom behaviour, also showed a third of teachers thought punishments for pupils should be extended to their parents.

'Punish parents'

Twice as many teachers believed parents were the cause of poor behaviour than thought it stemmed from other factors, such as a "lack of consistent school policy" or an "unimaginative curriculum".

The scale of the behaviour problem is also suggested by the survey - with a fifth of teachers saying as much as 10% of their lesson time is disrupted by poor behaviour.

Another fifth said even more of their time - 15% - was lost because of badly-behaved pupils.

Head teachers also wanted to see a tougher line on disruptive pupils - with almost two-thirds wanting more power to exclude pupils.

The leader of the Secondary Heads Association, John Dunford, supported the findings and criticised the appeals process, under which exclusions can be overturned.

'Frustration'

"The problem is that too often heads' decisions are challenged by parents and overruled by appeals panels which don't fully understand what is happening in the school.

"In too many cases, appeals panels are erratic and their judgements are based wholly on the circumstances of the individual child, without giving enough thought to other pupils and teachers in the school," said Mr Dunford.

Appeals should only be allowed on whether correct procedures were followed, not on the professional decision to exclude a pupil, said Mr Dunford.

He also supported the need for parents to recognise their responsibilities, saying: "Parents have responsibilities as well as rights and for too long the focus has been only on their rights."

Behaviour management specialist and Teachers' TV presenter John Bayley said the survey showed that it was clear that "teachers want parents to take more responsibility for their children's behaviour".

He added: "Relationships between home and school are central to student discipline and teachers' frustration shows we still have a long way to go in building a partnership between parents and schools."

The survey was carried out by ICM for Teachers' TV, a television channel for teachers funded by the Department for Education and Skills.

buttmunch · October 11th, 2005, 08:15 AM

Stop feeding them shit and they'll focus a hell of a lot better.

DisruptiveHair · October 11th, 2005, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buttmunch

Stop feeding them shit and they'll focus a hell of a lot better.

And actually DISCIPLINE them. I am so sick of kids whining at their parents BUY ME THIS and I'M BORED. If I said things like that as a child, my mother would reply "no" and "if you're bored, you're boring; find something to do." These kids don't behave because there are no consequences if they misbehave. Quite the opposite; they get tons of attention and adults wringing their hands wondering what they can BUY them or DO FOR them to make them stop.

How 'bout a smack in the mouth? That's my offer. It's on the table.

Glasgow53 · October 11th, 2005, 10:48 AM

I think a lot of times it is the parents' fault. When I was in college I was a student teacher, and sometimes we had behavior problems, and we would call the kid's parents, and the parents would say, "He is in school, he is your problem." Yeah, but in the long run, he is your kid. If someone at the school smacked him, you would be running down her to scream.

Grimmlok · October 11th, 2005, 10:53 AM

Parents don't parent anymore.. they let their kids do whatever they want, and indulge them in everything.

Kick the little fuckers outside, make them go play in the neighborhood, and STOP DRIVING THEM TO SCHOOL. Fuck, they have schoolbusses/bikes/rollerblades/skateboards for a reason. We don't need our roads clogged with parents who are driving their obese and lazy kids to school every day.

serenity · October 11th, 2005, 01:03 PM

I've seen both sides. I've seen parents that don't care what their kids do and these parents should be punished but I also have a girlfriend that has a boy that gets in trouble almost every single day and they have tried everything and I mean everything. They have tried to work with teachers, therapists and phychiatrists. Most of these people don't know what to do either. Of course they don't dare touch him or he will call the police, but they have tried every other thing imagineable to get him under control and nothing works. Whatever he is asked to do, he will do the opposite. And this boy is extremely intelligent.

LynnieD · October 11th, 2005, 01:16 PM

^^ That's part of his problem, he's intelligent and know's how to work it.

It's tough out there, being a parent. I know before I had a kid I was saying a lot of the same things you guys are. My daughter isn't even 2 yet, but all the things I swore I would never do, never let her get away with...well, it's a LOT easier said than done. It's very easy to sit there and say 'Do this, don't do this'. When that kid is sitting in that grocery cart screaming because they want something and you won't give it to them, well, it ain't fun. I do not give in btw, but its difficult to deal with constantly.
And unfortunately, these days, it's a whole new ball game in terms of child abduction, rapes, murders, drugs, smoking, sexual issues, etc. Where I grew up, none of these things were even mentioned. Now, sometimes you HAVE to drive your kid to school, simply to make sure the kid GETS THERE.
I am NOT disagreeing w/this article by the way, parents NEED to discipline their children and need to take responsiblity for their kids actions.
But it's not easy as it sounds....nothing about parenting is.

pacific breeze · October 11th, 2005, 01:20 PM

I've posted this before, but child abductions are extremely rare. The vast majority of children are far more likely to be abducted by their parents than a stranger.

Every time a white child is abducted it dominates the news for days. But that does not mean it is a common occurrence. I'll dig up the stats when I have more time.

It comes down to fear mongering for ratings -- violent crime rates are also substantially down -- but you'll never hear that stat on the evening news either.

Grimmlok · October 11th, 2005, 01:26 PM

Yeah, there aren't people scooping up kids anymore now than there used to be.. quite the opposite im betting.. it's just the media that plays it up to an insane degree.

As for misbehavior and making stupid mistakes, kids NEED to do that. If you constantly shelter your child they're going to be a complete retard and unable to deal with anything.

So they might get into a fight? So what. So they might fall down and bonk their head? So what. So they might suck at gym class, and be made fun of? So what.

Fucking hell, that's part of growing up. People need to relax.

LynnieD · October 11th, 2005, 01:43 PM

^ I don't disagree with you. But there are different things available now,then when we were growing up. The internet (we all know the shit out here), cable/satelitte TV, etc. It's just different.
Yes, they will fall, they will get in fights--and they have to learn. And they have to get out, play, run/skip, it's true. I completely agree.

And I swear, there is an attempted abduction every other week in Central NY. Yes, it's getting more news now, but I NEVER heard of anything of the kind growing up in the same general area just 20+ yrs ago.

As a parent you have to protect your children. You have to tell them, if someone approaches you that you don't know-do this. If someone tries to touch you in a 'naughty' place, you tell me. Etc, etc etc. You cannot relax in that respect. THAT'S being an irresponsible parent.

Ok, give it to me....

Grimmlok · October 11th, 2005, 01:58 PM

No, that's fine. Educating your children on those situations is exactly what should be done.

Being in such a state of fear that they can' take the schoolbus or ride their bike to work (NYC notwithstanding, we're talking suburbs here), or can't go outside and play, or that parents will jump down anybody's throat with a lawsuit if someone insults their child is stupid.

UndercoverGator · October 11th, 2005, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by disruptivehair

And actually DISCIPLINE them. I am so sick of kids whining at their parents BUY ME THIS and I'M BORED. If I said things like that as a child, my mother would reply "no" and "if you're bored, you're boring; find something to do." These kids don't behave because there are no consequences if they misbehave. Quite the opposite; they get tons of attention and adults wringing their hands wondering what they can BUY them or DO FOR them to make them stop.

How 'bout a smack in the mouth? That's my offer. It's on the table.

Amen! I think there's nothing wrong with the school system making the parents be parents and take responsiblity for their snotty lil' monster kids.

ohmygoodness · October 11th, 2005, 03:08 PM

I totally agree DH and UG. I'm 18 and I just left the public school system 3 months ago and the spoiled kids there are just disgusting. Even my friends are spoiled. A friend of mine is going to SFU and her parents are paying not only for her tuition and residence, but also at her request bought her a new car. Who needs a new car when they live on campus?!!? I don't even have a car and I live 2 hours from my campus, I take the bus. It makes me sick, quite honestly.

DisruptiveHair · October 11th, 2005, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LynnieD

^^ That's part of his problem, he's intelligent and know's how to work it.

It's tough out there, being a parent. I know before I had a kid I was saying a lot of the same things you guys are. My daughter isn't even 2 yet, but all the things I swore I would never do, never let her get away with...well, it's a LOT easier said than done. It's very easy to sit there and say 'Do this, don't do this'. When that kid is sitting in that grocery cart screaming because they want something and you won't give it to them, well, it ain't fun. I do not give in btw, but its difficult to deal with constantly.
And unfortunately, these days, it's a whole new ball game in terms of child abduction, rapes, murders, drugs, smoking, sexual issues, etc. Where I grew up, none of these things were even mentioned. Now, sometimes you HAVE to drive your kid to school, simply to make sure the kid GETS THERE.
I am NOT disagreeing w/this article by the way, parents NEED to discipline their children and need to take responsiblity for their kids actions.
But it's not easy as it sounds....nothing about parenting is.

I don't think any of us who don't have kids are stupid enough to think that it's easy. It's hard, but it's a job worth doing right. I know sometimes I'll give in, but dammit...I'm going to do my best to tune out the whining and be firm, like my mom was.

DisruptiveHair · October 11th, 2005, 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grimmlok

No, that's fine. Educating your children on those situations is exactly what should be done.

Being in such a state of fear that they can' take the schoolbus or ride their bike to work (NYC notwithstanding, we're talking suburbs here), or can't go outside and play, or that parents will jump down anybody's throat with a lawsuit if someone insults their child is stupid.

Per capita, NYC and LA are safer than many other American cities. The total number of crimes committed are higher, but we're talking about the two largest cities in the US. Per capita, places like DC, Dallas, and Atlanta are more dangerous.