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Thread: North Korea's Newest Threats Irk Its Main Ally China

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    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
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    Default North Korea's Newest Threats Irk Its Main Ally China

    North Korea's Newest Threats Irk Its Main Ally China - ABC News

    By GLORIA RIVIERA (@griviera)
    SEOUL, South Korea Jan. 25, 2013


    North Korea turned its anger today towards its neighbor, threatening South Korea in a statement released today.
    The latest outburst of belligerence came as North Korea's main ally China warned that it could pull its aid if North Korea doesn't tone it down and drop plans for another nuclear test.
    North Korea warned of "strong physical counter-measures" against South Korea if the country takes a "direct part" in U.S.-backed sanctions recently passed at the U.N.
    The statement was released by North Korea's Peaceful Committee for Reunification with the Fatherland. It came a day after another bellicose statement warning of imminent rocket launches and a third nuclear test targeting the U.S. Those remarks were issued by the National Defense Commission, which is headed up by North Korea's new leader, Kim Jong-Un.
    China has long been North Korea's main supporter in the region and a key provider of energy and food aid.

    China signaled its frustration with North Korea in an op-ed in the ultra-nationalistic newspaper the Global Times. "If North Korea engages in further nuclear tests, China will not hesitate to reduce its assistance to North Korea," the editorial said. it went on to say that if the U.S., Japan and South Korea "promote extreme U.N. sanctions on North Korea China will resolutely stop them and force them to amend these draft resolutions."
    China supported tightening sanctions against North Korea after its December missile launch.

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    Elite Member sputnik's Avatar
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    the north koreans have been busy little nuclear bees since their latest rocket launch mid-december. they're one of my dossiers at work and about a third of my workload usually but this week it's been pretty much all i've done. this latest statement was in response to the resolution adopted on tuesday by the security council and which broadened the sanctions against the dprk and put a bunch of new people on the list of designations. the statement itself is fucking awesome and written in brilliant engrish and includes jewels such as using 'hamstring' instead of hamper...
    i almost feel bad for the chinese. they need north korea as a buffer between them and south korea's allies (mainly the US), but they're like that embarrassing, alcoholic relative that every family has to deal with but can't outright disown.
    I'm open to everything. When you start to criticise the times you live in, your time is over. - Karl Lagerfeld

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    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sputnik View Post
    the north koreans have been busy little nuclear bees since their latest rocket launch mid-december. they're one of my dossiers at work and about a third of my workload usually but this week it's been pretty much all i've done. this latest statement was in response to the resolution adopted on tuesday by the security council and which broadened the sanctions against the dprk and put a bunch of new people on the list of designations. the statement itself is fucking awesome and written in brilliant engrish and includes jewels such as using 'hamstring' instead of hamper...
    i almost feel bad for the chinese. they need north korea as a buffer between them and south korea's allies (mainly the US), but they're like that embarrassing, alcoholic relative that every family has to deal with but can't outright disown.
    Thanks for the additional information. I've read that China is also propping up North Korea because if the regime falls, China will be dealing with a massive refugee/humanitarian situation with many tens of thousands of people fleeing across the border into their country.

    Still, I can't figure out the rationale for what North Korea is doing. Previously, it seemed like a gambit for more aid, or for a different arrangement in the multi-party talks between North Korea and other countries. This latest situation seems like a pretty dramatic spike upward in rhetoric/gamesmanship.

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    Elite Member sputnik's Avatar
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    a lot of people were banking on the son being different from the father and maybe opening the country up a little bit, being more conciliatory with south korea and pushing for an actual peace agreement. but really it's quite the opposite, even though south korea just elected a conservative who has said it's her intention to push for reunification of the two koreas or at least peace.
    north korea really is the land where time stopped. they are extremely insular. and with extreme insularity comes extreme paranoia. they despise the US and they think the US is using its allies in the region - mainly south korea and japan - to build up its military presence in the region through the UN Commando which was set up at the time of the armistice agreement and that is led by the US even though it operates under the UN name. they accuse the US of opposing the end of the armistice agreement and the negotation of a real peace agreement between the 2 koreas because it is in their interest to maintain the current situation. they've also mismanaged the economy and have spent a disproportionate amount of it on its army, to the detriment of its people who are literally starving to death. all opposition is quashed and imprisoned and there are literally hundreds of thousands of people in camps, some of whom were born there and have nothing to do with the alleged 'crimes' of their parents.

    they see nuclear weapons as the only deterrent against its enemies and also as a symbol of its national power and prestige and as a way of at least giving the impression at home that they are a military power 'feared' by its enemies. whether or not the leaders themselves believe this is anyone's guess. they could also think they simply don't have a choice anymore and that they have nothing else left to lose because they realise that the minute they open the country up, the floodgates will open and people will demand change and they will be the first to go. so they stick with supporting the kim dynasty and becoming specialists in weapons and nuclear material smuggling (to and from north korea - they also have quite the clandestine arms trade with syria and iran).

    they can't afford to get into a real argument with china though. last time relations cooled between the 2, the security council acted and imposed sanctions on north korea that wouldn't have been possible had china not begun to lose patience with north korea. relations then improved and china began blocking new action against north korea in the council again and now if this spat turns out to be true, it could be a sign that china is growing exasperated again...
    it's a shitty situation and i think this little new guy is the last of the dynasty. i doubt they will last more than another 5-10 years, especially if the economic situation doesn't improve.
    I'm open to everything. When you start to criticise the times you live in, your time is over. - Karl Lagerfeld

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    Elite Member BITTER's Avatar
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    They are scaring the hell out of me lately. I hope it is all bluff.
    But whether it is or isn't, why all the unprovoked threats???
    Good luck getting a cat to do anything let alone join in on your sexcapades. - Air Quotes

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    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
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    1. I think they want to go back to the negotiating table with us for more aid/money.
    2. They want to make a big international splash for Kim Jong Un.

    It also sounds like they are actually close to putting a nuclear bomb small enough to fit on a multi-stage rocket.

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    Elite Member BITTER's Avatar
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    What do they hope to accomplish by dropping a bomb on someone? Besides, we'd smoke them if they pulled some shit like that.
    I know a large percentages of North Koreans suffer from malnutrition and live in substandard conditions...where is the money going? The money that they've already been sent?
    Good luck getting a cat to do anything let alone join in on your sexcapades. - Air Quotes

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    My dad is pissed about all this escalation. He fought in the Korean war and if Macarthur hadn't been stopped by Truman, we would have killed Lil Kim's grandfather and all this shit wouldn't be happening right now.
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    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greysfang View Post
    My dad is pissed about all this escalation. He fought in the Korean war and if Macarthur hadn't been stopped by Truman, we would have killed Lil Kim's grandfather and all this shit wouldn't be happening right now.
    I was reading a little about it on vacation. I think that Truman and other policy advisors were worried about getting embroiled in a larger conflict, involving China, who had sent thousands of "volunteers" across the border and into the Chosin Reservoir. It was a battle just to keep our guys from being swamped and get most of them safely back into South Korea. We would have to have been prepared to drop another a-bomb to stay up there, and nobody had the stomach to do that, except MacArthur, I guess.

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    Quote Originally Posted by greysfang View Post
    My dad is pissed about all this escalation. He fought in the Korean war and if Macarthur hadn't been stopped by Truman, we would have killed Lil Kim's grandfather and all this shit wouldn't be happening right now.

    My step Dad was in Korea, and he said basically the same thing. Sounds like Lil Kim is just like his Grandpa,...always wanting to stir shit up and look like a big man.


    Do you ever notice how Lil Kim is ALWAYS the fattest person in any picture he takes??? Is he the only one eating good over there??

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    This idiot can't shoot himself in the foot enough. The whole region is tired of him. Nothing that happened would surprise me.
    I didn't start out to collect diamonds, but somehow they just kept piling up.-Mae West

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    nothing's going to happen, china won't let them.
    and btw, they are nuclear. and a couple of days ago, the pentagon's intelligence arm acknowledged that north korea has nuclear warhead capability - i.e. they can make a nuclear weapon small enough to be delivered by a ballistic missile. mind you, this is the same division that assured the world that saddam hussein's iraq had nuclear capability...
    Quote Originally Posted by MohandasKGanja View Post
    I was reading a little about it on vacation. I think that Truman and other policy advisors were worried about getting embroiled in a larger conflict, involving China, who had sent thousands of "volunteers" across the border and into the Chosin Reservoir. It was a battle just to keep our guys from being swamped and get most of them safely back into South Korea. We would have to have been prepared to drop another a-bomb to stay up there, and nobody had the stomach to do that, except MacArthur, I guess.
    truman was right and macarthur was wrong. they did the right thing because it wouldn't just have been a war against kim il sung, it was much bigger than that. remember this was during the cold war, it would have meant war against china and, by extension, russia. north korea is a buffer between china and south korea - a staunch US ally.
    I'm open to everything. When you start to criticise the times you live in, your time is over. - Karl Lagerfeld

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    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sputnik View Post
    nothing's going to happen, china won't let them.
    and btw, they are nuclear. and a couple of days ago, the pentagon's intelligence arm acknowledged that north korea has nuclear warhead capability - i.e. they can make a nuclear weapon small enough to be delivered by a ballistic missile. mind you, this is the same division that assured the world that saddam hussein's iraq had nuclear capability...

    truman was right and macarthur was wrong. they did the right thing because it wouldn't just have been a war against kim il sung, it was much bigger than that. remember this was during the cold war, it would have meant war against china and, by extension, russia. north korea is a buffer between china and south korea - a staunch US ally.
    And it was coming right on the heels of WWII. After sacrificing so many of our own people in a war that was declared AGAINST us, it would been a squandering of people and resources to dramatically enlarge a wide-ranging and unpredictable conflict in an area that our own state department had declared was outside our zones of interest.

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    Elite Member Geest's Avatar
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    I've already paid for my plane tickets for my SE Asia trip in the summer, he better not do anything rush before I get back from an amazing tour, or else.
    McJag likes this.

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    Thanks for the background info sput, Living kinda in the region I ought to know more about this shit than I do. But Im still struggling to understand exactly what NK hopes to achieve with all this belligerent rhetoric. Surely even Krazy Kim knows what would happen if he nuked Seoul. Im somewhat sceptical about his military capacity anyway having seen those laughably amateur fake "stealth bomber" pics.

    The Kim dynasty seems to be heading the way of many powerful families. The first generation establishes itself, the second generation consolidates it, and the third generation destroys it.
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