Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 32

Thread: Palestinians rally for full membership

  1. #1
    Bronze Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    221

    Default Palestinians rally for full membership

    Palestinians rally in support of statehood
    Thousands gather in Ramallah and Nablus in a show of support for Mahmoud Abbas' bid for full memnership at the UN.
    Last Modified: 21 Sep 2011 09:27


    The Palestinians are turning to the UN after peace talks with Israel stalled [EPA]
    Tens of thousands of people have gathered in Ramallah and Nablus in the occupied West Bank in a show of support for a Palestinian bid to secure full membership at the United Nations.

    The rallies started hours before the much-awaited speech by the US President Barack Obama on the issue that has set the Palestinians on a collision course with Israel and its allies.

    "They [the US] have used different forms of pressure, threats, and many others, sending letters, sending ambassadors, etcetera, etcetera ... Amazing"

    - Riyad al-Maliki, Palestinian foreign minister

    Obama has vowed to veto the Palestinian bid, backing Israel's view that direct talks offer the only route to peace.

    Al Jazeera's Cal Perry, reporting from Ramallah, said people rallying in Ramallah on Wednesday were aware of the diplomatic talks taking place in New York.

    Thousands marched into Arafat Square in Ramallah and schools and some businesses were shut as people came out in support of the bid for Palestinian statehood, he said.

    In Nablus, some rallyists said it was a big day for Obama. "Lets hope he does not let us down," they said.

    Obama is to meet Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas and Israeli Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu in an effort to defuse the situation after his speech.

    US to veto bid

    Recognising that Abbas seems intent to proceed, Obama is expected to privately ask the Palestinian leader to essentially drop the move for statehood recognition after Abbas delivers a formal letter of intent to the UN on Friday, after his address to the UN General Assembly.

    "The president will say, frankly, the same thing in private that he'll say in public, which is that we do not believe that this is the best course of action for achieving Palestinian aspirations," said Ben Rhodes, the White House deputy national security adviser.


    Obama's stand has surprised the Palestinians, with the Palestinian foreign minister saying he was "amazed" by the US efforts to persuade other countries not to support the UN bid.

    "They have used different forms of pressure, threats, and many others, sending letters, sending ambassadors, etcetera, etcetera... Amazing," Riyad al-Maliki told Al Jazeera.

    Talking to Al Jazeera's Gregg Carlstrom, senior Palestinian activist Mustafa Barghouti, also expressed his surprise over the US opposition.

    "I think it is very strange that Obama will veto a bid for Palestinian statehood, when a year ago at the UN General Assembly he supported the idea," he said.

    "Palestinian statehood will create a new political situation where Israeli will be occupying another country."


    The Palestinian Liberation Organisation (PLO) under Abbas is pressing for statehood after talks with Israel led to nowhere.

    The Obama administration say that only direct peace negotiations, not a UN vote, would allow the Palestinians to achieve the benefits of statehood.

    The new approach being considered would see the "quartet" of the peace mediators, including the US, UN, European Union and Russia - issue a statement addressing both Palestinian and Israeli concerns and setting a timetable for a return to the long-stalled peace talks, officials close to the diplomatic talks said.

    The statement would also endorse the idea of "two states for two peoples, Jewish and Palestinian", according to the Associated Press news agency.

    The White House publicly appeared to hold out slight hope that enough progress could be made to stop Abbas from formally requesting statehood recognition.

    "President Abbas has indicated his determination to go to the Security Council, so we take him at his word on that," Rhodes said.

    Enhanced observer

    The simmering situation is far from the scenario Obama envisioned when he spoke at the UN one year ago.

    "We should reach for what's best within ourselves," Obama said last September in pushing for negotiated agreement on a sovereign Palestinian state. "If we do, when we come back here next year, we can have an agreement that will lead to a new member of the United Nations."

    Should the Palestinian bid fail, Abbas could ask for a vote of the General Assembly for an enhanced observer status, which is enjoyed by others such as the Vatican, in which case no veto would be possible.

    While UN recognition would have largely a symbolic value, the Palestinians argue that it would strengthen their hands in peace talks with Israel, especially on the final issues that divide them.

    These are the precise location of the border, the final status of Jerusalem, the right of return of Palestinian refugees, water, and security.

    On Wednesday, clashes broke out at the Qalandiya Crossing between Ramallah and Jerusalem.

    Carlstrom reported that Israeli troops had fired tear gas to disperse an estimated 50 rock-throwing young people.

    Several youths and one Israeli soldier were said to have been injured

    Palestinians rally in support of statehood - Middle East - Al Jazeera English

  2. #2
    Elite Member greysfang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Burning Down Your Windmill
    Posts
    52,140

    Default

    That's it. Obama is officially on my hate list.
    FUCK YOU AND GIVE ME MY GODDAMN VENTI TWO PUMP LIGHT WHIP MOCHA YOU COCKSUCKING WHORE BEFORE I PUNCH YOU IN THE MOUTH. I just get unpleasant in my car. - Deej

    http://www.gossiprocks.com/forum/signaturepics/sigpic4098_9.gif Healthy is merely the slowest possible rate at which one can die.

  3. #3
    Elite Member cherrypye's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    The Great State
    Posts
    1,958

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by greysfang View Post
    That's it. Obama is officially on my hate list.
    Agreed. And I'm an Obama fantard.

  4. #4
    Elite Member witchcurlgirl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Acerbia
    Posts
    33,872

    Default

    The world will allow the Palestinians a state immediately after they let the Kurds and Basques have a state.



    eta: But this UN bid is more about the internal power struggle between the PLO and Hamas than it is about a state.
    Last edited by witchcurlgirl; September 22nd, 2011 at 10:17 AM.
    It's no longer a dog whistle, it's a fucking trombone


    All of God's children are not beautiful. Most of God's children are, in fact, barely presentable.


    If I wanted the government in my womb I'd fuck a Senator

  5. #5
    Elite Member ManxMouse's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Lemuria
    Posts
    7,617

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by greysfang View Post
    That's it. Obama is officially on my hate list.
    Funny, because the Repubs are harping on how he doesn't support Israel and has somehow favored the Palestinians over and over. He just can't win.

    Someone I know, who is American married to a Palestinian man, just moved from Austin to Ramallah in March. They have a not-yet 2 year old and a 3 year-old. I think she's crazy for doing it, but her blog is fascinating. She's apprehensive about the unrest this is going to cause, to say the least.
    Santa is an elitist mother fucker -- giving expensive shit to rich kids and nothing to poor kids.

  6. #6
    Elite Member sluce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Top Secret Spy for Leann Rimes
    Posts
    37,343

    Default

    I am an intelligent and aware woman but there is just something about the strife in the middle east that causes me to shut down. I don't want to hear about it or read about it. I try to avoid cluster fucks in life and that is what that whole region represents to me.
    You don't engage with crazies. Because they're, you know, fucking crazy. - WitchCurlGirl

  7. #7
    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Wherever my kids are
    Posts
    26,258

    Default

    As far as I can tell, the article doesn't mention the fact that Congressional Republicans were absolutely freaking the f*ck out over this.

    First, threatening to cancel all aid to the Palestinians - including aid that provides for JOINT SECURITY between the Palestinians and Israel (aka, cutting off your nose to spite your face).

    Second, they were threatening to cancel all U.S. contributions to the U.N. AND cancel any aid to any country that voted in favor of Palestinian statehood.

    Then, they had that Joe Walsh Republican dude (the one who I think has some child support issues?) saying that Israel would be justified in formally annexing the West Bank and Gaza, if the Palestinians petitioned for statehood.

    THAT is the kind of crazy that Obama is trying to deal with.

  8. #8
    Elite Member sputnik's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    fellow traveller
    Posts
    52,224

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by witchcurlgirl View Post
    The world will allow the Palestinians a state immediately after they let the Kurds and Basques have a state.



    eta: But this UN bid is more about the internal power struggle between the PLO and Hamas than it is about a state.
    the basque situation is a bit more complicated, since it is unlikely a majority of basques want to separate from spain. it's not unlike the quebec situation.

    i'm of 2 minds about this. yes, i support palestinian statehood. but i don't think a UN vote is going to solve anything. it still won't decide on what this state's borders are. and yeah, israel needs to get its act together but honestly, so does the palestinian authority. that government is a mess, not just because of the struggle between the PLO and hamas but also because of the rampant corruption.
    so even if the UN votes to grant palestine statehood (which the US will then veto anyway), the only way the conflict will be resolved is through peace talks with israel. so really it's all a big fuss and in the end we'll be back to square one.
    I'm open to everything. When you start to criticise the times you live in, your time is over. - Karl Lagerfeld

  9. #9
    Silver Member Working Girl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    On the chain gang
    Posts
    391

    Default

    The world will allow the Palestinians a state immediately after they let the Kurds and Basques have a state

    Don't forget the indians in the USA/Canada
    The Aborigines in Australia

  10. #10
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    In WhoreLand fucking your MOM
    Posts
    55,372

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MohandasKGanja View Post
    As far as I can tell, the article doesn't mention the fact that Congressional Republicans were absolutely freaking the f*ck out over this.

    First, threatening to cancel all aid to the Palestinians - including aid that provides for JOINT SECURITY between the Palestinians and Israel (aka, cutting off your nose to spite your face).

    Second, they were threatening to cancel all U.S. contributions to the U.N. AND cancel any aid to any country that voted in favor of Palestinian statehood.

    Then, they had that Joe Walsh Republican dude (the one who I think has some child support issues?) saying that Israel would be justified in formally annexing the West Bank and Gaza, if the Palestinians petitioned for statehood.

    THAT is the kind of crazy that Obama is trying to deal with.
    Probably shouldn't have given them everything they ever wanted from the beginning of his presidency then. Too bad, failbama. Grow a set.

    Also, "peace talks" are useless. They don't accomplish anything... and given the below, if you were Israel, what would peace talks to you be but a time waster as you absorbed the rest of the land?

    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

  11. #11
    Elite Member sputnik's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    fellow traveller
    Posts
    52,224

    Default

    lol grimm the conflict in the middle east isn't obama's fault. it was a clusterfuck before he came along and it will be one after he leaves office. and it's not true that peace talk don't accomplish anything - a lot of conflicts have ended after peace agreements were reached between all parties.

    the u.s. has always defended israel. if anything, under obama they have been slightly less one-sided in their defence. but they are not going to do a 180 and suddenly reverse their position. and it's not just republicans. poll democrats and i'm pretty sure most of them agree with a u.s. veto.

    and besides, like it's been said before, recognition of statehood won't end the conflict and it won't bring about peace. is it symbolically significant? yes. and the vote should go on as planned. but even if the u.s. didn't veto, nothing would change in practice.
    I'm open to everything. When you start to criticise the times you live in, your time is over. - Karl Lagerfeld

  12. #12
    Elite Member Grimmlok's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    In WhoreLand fucking your MOM
    Posts
    55,372

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sputnik View Post
    lol grimm the conflict in the middle east isn't obama's fault.
    I didn't say it was, I said the level of crazy he's facing at home is due to him consistently caving and/or enacting their policies.

    and it's not true that peace talk don't accomplish anything - a lot of conflicts have ended after peace agreements were reached between all parties.
    As you can see by the handy illustration, it's not working in this case.

    the u.s. has always defended israel. if anything, under obama they have been slightly less one-sided in their defence. but they are not going to do a 180 and suddenly reverse their position. and it's not just republicans. poll democrats and i'm pretty sure most of them agree with a u.s. veto.
    I'm sure they do, but not for any other interests but their own and certainly not for anybody actually living in the area.

    and besides, like it's been said before, recognition of statehood won't end the conflict and it won't bring about peace. is it symbolically significant? yes. and the vote should go on as planned. but even if the u.s. didn't veto, nothing would change in practice.
    It's SOMETHING, which is more that dead "peace talks" are accomplishing while the Israelis build more and more settlements on land that doesn't belong to them.
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

  13. #13
    Elite Member sluce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Top Secret Spy for Leann Rimes
    Posts
    37,343

    Default

    One of the reasons I block the middle east, primarily Israel and Palestine, from my mind, is the religious implications. I married a Jew. Many of my closest friends are Jews. My husband did not embrace his Judiasm as an adult but still had the mind set that Jews were owed a homeland and were justified in taking Palestine. It makes me crazy. I do not believe the US would be so pro-Israel if in fact the majority of financial institutions were not started and run by Jews. For some reason, early in the beginning of the US it was the Jews who controlled financial America. That is not a negative and I am not anti-semite. It is just historical fact that I believe has colored the way the US responds to the conflict.
    You don't engage with crazies. Because they're, you know, fucking crazy. - WitchCurlGirl

  14. #14
    Elite Member sputnik's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    fellow traveller
    Posts
    52,224

    Default

    nationalism is nationalism is nationalism. doesn't matter if it's jewish, muslim, etc.
    i forget what historical figure it was who said zionism is a nationalism like any other. but we forget that because of what happened to the jews in ww2.
    I'm open to everything. When you start to criticise the times you live in, your time is over. - Karl Lagerfeld

  15. #15
    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Wherever my kids are
    Posts
    26,258

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimmlok View Post
    Probably shouldn't have given them everything they ever wanted from the beginning of his presidency then. Too bad, failbama. Grow a set.

    Also, "peace talks" are useless. They don't accomplish anything... and given the below, if you were Israel, what would peace talks to you be but a time waster as you absorbed the rest of the land?
    On your second point, I agree. Someone described Israel's approach to the peace talks and land deals as "Negotiating over someone about how to divide up a pizza, while the other person sits and eats the pizza".

    With regard to the first point, another factor came into play. Obama is also worried about traditionally Democrat-leaning jewish voters in the upcoming election. Democrats just lost a traditionally safe district (Anthony Wiener's) in a special election, where the Republican depicted Obama and the Democrats as being Israel haters for trying to prod them to go to the negotiating table. So now, an additional aspect of USA realpolitik is also getting in the way of trying to move the MiddleEast forward.

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Barack Obama panders to the Palestinians on Jerusalem
    By witchcurlgirl in forum U.S. Politics and Issues
    Replies: 14
    Last Post: July 29th, 2008, 08:06 AM
  2. U.S. to send $59 million to Palestinians' Abbas
    By AliceInWonderland in forum U.S. Politics and Issues
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: April 16th, 2007, 12:17 PM
  3. Palestinians vow revenge at Gaza funeral for 18
    By AliceInWonderland in forum News
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: November 10th, 2006, 02:44 AM
  4. U.S. to give Palestinians $10 million
    By AliceInWonderland in forum News
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: May 10th, 2006, 12:14 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •