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Old January 31st, 2009, 12:19 AM   #1 (permalink)
Honey
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Default School can expel lesbian students, court rules

An appeals panel finds California Lutheran High School in Riverside County is not a business and therefore doesn't have to comply with a state law barring discrimination based on sexual orientation

Reporting from San Francisco -- After a Lutheran school expelled two 16-year-old girls for having "a bond of intimacy" that was "characteristic of a lesbian relationship," the girls sued, contending the school had violated a state anti-discrimination law.

In response to that suit, an appeals court decided this week that the private religious school was not a business and therefore did not have to comply with a state law that prohibits businesses from discriminating. A lawyer for the girls said Tuesday that he would ask the California Supreme Court to overturn the unanimous ruling by a three-judge panel of the 4th District Court of Appeal.
The appeals court called its decision "narrow," but lawyers on both sides of the case said it would protect private religious schools across California from such discrimination suits.
Kirk D. Hanson, who represented the girls, said the "very troubling" ruling would permit private schools to discriminate against anyone, as long as the schools used their religious beliefs as justification.
"It is almost like it could roll back 20 to 30 years of progress we have made in this area," said the San Diego attorney. "Basically, this decision gives private schools the license to discriminate."
John McKay, who represented the Riverside County-based California Lutheran High School, said the ruling correctly acknowledged that the school's purpose was to "teach Christian values in a Christian setting pursuant to a Christian code of conduct."

The girls were expelled in their junior year for "conducting themselves in a manner consistent with being lesbians," said McKay, who added that the girls never disclosed their sexual orientation during the litigation. Hanson said the girls had been "best friends" and, citing their privacy, declined to discuss their sexual orientation. They are now in college, he said.
The dispute started when a student at the school told a teacher in 2005 that one of the girls had said she loved the other. The student advised the teacher to look at the girls' MySpace pages. One of the girls was identified as bisexual on her MySpace page, the other's page said she was "not sure" of her sexual orientation.
McKay said the website also contained a photograph of the girls hugging.
According to the principal, who called each girl out of class separately, both admitted they had hugged and kissed each other and told other students they were lesbians. The girls said they admitted only that they loved each other as friends.
The principal "just looked at me like I was a disease and I was so wrong," one of the girls later said. They were identified in the legal proceedings only as Jane Doe and Mary Roe.
In ruling in favor of the school, the appeals court cited a 1998 California Supreme Court decision that said the Boy Scouts of America was a social organization, not a business establishment, and therefore did not have to comply with the Unruh Civil Rights Act. That case also involved a discrimination complaint based on sexual orientation.

"The school's religious message is inextricably intertwined with its secular functions," wrote Justice Betty A. Richli for the appeals court. "The whole purpose of sending one's child to a religious school is to ensure that he or she learns even secular subjects within a religious framework."
The school is affiliated with synods that believe homosexuality is a sin, the court said. The school's "Christian conduct" code said students could be expelled for engaging in immoral or scandalous contact, on or off campus.
In addition to their discrimination claim, the girls complained that the school invaded their privacy and detained them unlawfully. The girls complained the principal sat "very close" to them and asked them if they were bisexual, if they had kissed each other, and whether they had done anything "inappropriate," the court said.
Mary Roe said, "He got very close to me and he said, 'Have you ever touched [Jane Doe] in . . . any inappropriate ways? And he looked me up and down when he asked that."
But the court said there was no evidence that the principal had a prurient interest in the girls.
"It is hard to imagine how he could have determined whether they had a homosexual relationship without asking the questions that he in fact asked," wrote Richli, appointed to the court by former Gov. Pete Wilson.

The school also did not break the law when it disclosed the girls' "suspected sexual orientation" to their parents, the court said. The parents, "in light of their right to control their children's upbringing and education, had a right to know why" they were being expelled, the court said.
Hanson said the entire episode was "very traumatic" and "humiliating" for the girls.
Shannon Price Minter, legal director of the National Center for Lesbian Rights, said the ruling was based on "the particular circumstances of this school."
"Labeling a young person or telling her she is 'sinful' can be psychologically devastating," Minter said. "Regardless of one's religious beliefs, all adults have a responsibility to treat young people with compassion and respect."

School officials could not be reached for comment.

Timothy J. Tracey, litigation counsel for the Center for Law & Religious Freedom, said the ruling "preserves the right of Christian schools in California to make admission and discipline decisions consistent with their religious beliefs."

School can expel lesbian students, court rules - Los Angeles Times
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Old January 31st, 2009, 10:33 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Fucktards.
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Old January 31st, 2009, 10:37 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Fucktards. Lets worry about actual education problems in school, not sexual orientation.
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Old January 31st, 2009, 11:57 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Umm, go to public school or a private school that isn't based in a very strict religion.

Appealing this won't do anything. If it isn't a business and states it is a religious school, they have no argument. It's ridiculous to worry about the sex lives of their students, but if it became public knowledge and they are doing something that goes against the rules or doctrine, they know the consequences.

There are really only two ways to deal with schools like this. Either live your life and risk being thrown out or don't go in the first place. I don't understand why people act victimized when this happens. I don't agree with these religions, so I don't deal with them in any way. If you deal with them, knowing they don't like you or your lifestyle, why be surprised when they tell you and show you the door?
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Old January 31st, 2009, 12:38 PM   #5 (permalink)
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^^^^
i agree. unless they receive even one cent of state money. in which case, shut their asses down.

that said, i also think these people are assholes and they could be doing a lot of damage to the girls.
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Old January 31st, 2009, 12:46 PM   #6 (permalink)
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^^ I totally agree fundamentalists are the most hypocritical, uptight, pompous jackasses on the planet; however, unless their bullshit is being funded by the taxpayers, in any way, they have every right to discuss and teach their doctrines within the walls they pay for privately and to throw out those who don't fit into their molds.

If you want to end this, don't donate to their organizations. Don't support them. Most importantly, don't buy into their craziness or send your children to them for brainwashing.

This lawsuit was seeking to challenge a church's right to follow its beliefs. Sorry, but no can do. They don't take public money, we, as the public, have no right to tell them they have to change or accept anything.
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Old January 31st, 2009, 01:31 PM   #7 (permalink)
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would it kill them to go to another school
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Old January 31st, 2009, 03:35 PM   #8 (permalink)
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But what kind of precedent does this set? Apparently, all the "proof" this school needed was hearsay and photos of two girls hugging. Are the bullies and bitches going to be able to get rid of students they dislike by falsely telling a teacher that their classmate is gay? Will straight kids be unfairly singled out and expelled because they're just tomboys, or flamboyant - or simply because the school is looking for an excuse to expel them?

What else will private Christian schools be able to use as a reason for expelling kids on the basis of "unChristian conduct"? Perhaps they'll start kicking out students suspected of having had an abortion, practicing Wicca, or arguing in favour of evolution...
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Old January 31st, 2009, 03:41 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GawsipRawksz View Post
would it kill them to go to another school
It's not always a simple thing to find another school to go to. One may not exist; the ones that exist may have no openings. And because different schools have different curricula, you can find that you don't have the credits to graduate on time, and on and on.

And once you've been tossed from a school, it's a big black mark on your record as far as most other schools are concerned.
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Old January 31st, 2009, 06:43 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katerpillar View Post
But what kind of precedent does this set? Apparently, all the "proof" this school needed was hearsay and photos of two girls hugging. Are the bullies and bitches going to be able to get rid of students they dislike by falsely telling a teacher that their classmate is gay? Will straight kids be unfairly singled out and expelled because they're just tomboys, or flamboyant - or simply because the school is looking for an excuse to expel them?

What else will private Christian schools be able to use as a reason for expelling kids on the basis of "unChristian conduct"? Perhaps they'll start kicking out students suspected of having had an abortion, practicing Wicca, or arguing in favour of evolution...
If those actions violate their policies or doctrines, yes, they can. A Wicca in a fundie school makes no sense anyway.

Religion has its rights, even if the beliefs are loony in many cases. If I read correctly, one of the girls in question described herself as bisexual on a webpage, which is public domain. If no one hacked her account, she admitted she was into guys, which is ok, and girls, which is not, according to the church funding that school.

The girls have no legal action in this case and the court decision was correct.
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Old January 31st, 2009, 10:18 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Fates, please grant me the power to simply destroy religion and annihilate all those who resist.

*waits*
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Old February 1st, 2009, 01:58 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Who is the bigot now? Religious people should be annihilated because their beliefs aren't the same as yours? I see bigotry isn't confined to the church or the heteros.

Religion isn't going anywhere and nor should it. If you don't like it, don't practice it.

Is that too hard to understand? Apparently so.
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Old February 1st, 2009, 03:05 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Have these girls been proven to be lesbian? Has anyone witnessed first hand acts of lesbianism between them or has either or both of them stated in an interview with the school authorities that yes, this is their sexual orientation? (and saying that you are bi on a webpage doesn't count - I've lost count of the number of my housemate's neice's teeny friends who have declared themselves to be bisexual because they think its different/angsty/controversial/edgy and who would rather die than actually muff dive or indulge in butt love).

No?

Then why the hell does this school see fit to brand them and expell them?

Jeebus Crap A'mighty! Lock up ya daughters! Tharr be lesbanians on th' loose! Oh, no, wait... Maybe its just an intense teenage friendship being coloured to appear as something else by repressed adults with overly dirty minds.

Whatever the truth of these girls sexual preferences there isn't any PROOF that they are or were engaging in a same-sex relationship, and aside from the fact that expulsion for being gay is wrong anyway IMHO, so is expulsion based on gossip and innuendo!

Also, what if this is actually just a very intense teenage friendship? Everyone in their school and local community will know who they are and now they will have to live with swirling rumours, assumptions and prejudice because some uptight dickwads let their bottled-up libidos become warped.

I say it again - FUCKTARDS!
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Old February 1st, 2009, 03:09 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Well, they need to be kicked out or this kind of behavior will spread. They'll be turning all the other girls into lesbians, and that simply won't do.
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Old February 1st, 2009, 08:42 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Eh, at my school even the straights weren't allowed to be together. Kissing, hand holding, hugging... it all got you a detention.
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