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Old June 12th, 2006, 03:36 PM   #1 (permalink)
sweetrebel
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Default Owner says "English only" and under fire

MSNBC News Services
Updated: 7:45 a.m. CT June 12, 2006
PHILADELPHIA - City officials are expected to file a complaint Monday against an English-only ordering policy at Geno’s Steaks, one of Philadelphia’s best-known cheesesteak joints that has entered the national immigration debate.

Situated in a South Philadelphia immigrant neighborhood, Geno’s has posted small signs telling customers, “This Is AMERICA: WHEN ORDERING ‘SPEAK ENGLISH.’”

“We’re alleging that the sign itself is enough of an unwelcoming message that it may violate the Fair Practices Act,” Rachel Lawton, acting executive director of the Philadelphia Commission on Human Relations, told the Philadelphia Inquirer.

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Owner Joseph Vento, 66, whose grandparents struggled to learn English after immigrating from Sicily in the 1920s, said he posted the sign about six months ago amid concerns over immigration reform and the increasing number of customers who could not order in English when they wanted Philly’s gooey, greasy specialty — fried steak, sliced or chopped, in a long roll, with cheese and fried onions.

“They don’t know how lucky they are. All we’re asking them to do is learn the English language,” said Vento. “We’re out to help these people, but they’ve got to help themselves, too.”

Diverse community
The traditionally Italian community near Geno’s has become more diverse over the decades. Immigrants from Asia and Latin America have moved in, joining longtime residents and young professionals seeking reasonably priced rowhouses. In the past 10 years, an estimated 15,000 to 20,000 Mexican immigrants — many of them here illegally, community leaders say — have settled in South Philly.

Vento said his staff is glad to help non-native speakers order in English and has never turned someone away because of a language barrier.


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The Inquirer also quoted Mary Catherine Roper, a spokeswoman for the American Civil Liberties Union, who said Geno’s “has a right to express its opinion, however offensive. ... But there are specific limitations on places of public accommodation, because they are supposed to be available to everyone.”

A city councilman quoted in the paper said the signs were “divisive and mean-spirited.”

Cheesesteaks and ‘freedom fries’
When a non-English speaking customer showed up at the window a short time later, a clerk patiently coached him through the process. Eventually, both said “cheesesteak.”

Vento, a short, fiery man with a ninth-grade education, arms covered in tattoos and a large diamond ring in his ear, also sells “freedom fries” to protest France’s opposition to the Iraq war. He rails against Mumia Abu-Jamal, the black man who was convicted of killing police Officer Daniel Faulkner in 1981 and has become a cause celebre among some death penalty opponents. Memorials to Faulkner are posted at his shop.

Vento said he has gotten plenty of criticism and threats. One person told him they hoped one his many neon signs flames out and burns the place down, he said. But he said he plans to hold his ground.

Competitors are seizing on the controversy.

Tony Luke’s issued a statement saying it welcomes all customers “whether or not they speak a ‘wit’ of English.”

And a manager at Pat’s, Kathy Smith, said of Geno’s English-only policy: “That’s the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard in my life. I’d rather listen to the Spanish than the foul language of the college students.”
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Old June 12th, 2006, 03:43 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Owner says "English only" and under fire

It seems reasonable that in a restaurant you'd have to order in a language the waiters/waitresses understand - how in the world would they get their order if they didn't?

He's not saying they can't speak another language while they are in the place, so I guess I don't see how this is a controversy ...
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Old June 12th, 2006, 03:47 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Owner says "English only" and under fire

Quote:
Originally Posted by cloud
It seems reasonable that in a restaurant you'd have to order in a language the waiters/waitresses understand - how in the world would they get their order if they didn't?

He's not saying they can't speak another language while they are in the place, so I guess I don't see how this is a controversy ...
the owner has every right to refuse service to anyone he chooses. i think it would be far better however to let the folks ask for their food in spanish and give them the same treatment they would give us... a blank stare and repeat "may I help you" over and over again in English until they give up and leave.. or starve to death whichever comes first.
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Old June 12th, 2006, 03:49 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Owner says "English only" and under fire

He's not refusing service to anyone. He's just telling people to speak English. It's his damn store, for pete's sake.

ETA: I posted mine before reading yours, Junglemonkey. Yes, he does have the right to refuse service if he wants. I just didn't get the feeling that he was doing that. But even if he did, well, isn't that his perogative?
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Old June 12th, 2006, 03:52 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Owner says "English only" and under fire

that is such a rude ass sign; if you can tell that someone speaks another language and so do you then why not speak it; jesus christo! what is w/ the english only shit anyways; its so ridiculous!

when i'm w/ someone who speaks spanish and so does our waiter they order in spanish; big fuck me deal ppl!
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Old June 12th, 2006, 03:59 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Owner says "English only" and under fire

So is the sign in English?
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Old June 12th, 2006, 04:01 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Owner says "English only" and under fire

Reminds me of the sign i saw in a BK in Georgia:

"If you can't read the menu, point at what you want."

How the fuck are they supposed to read THAT.
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Old June 12th, 2006, 04:01 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Owner says "English only" and under fire

hahahahaha ^ yeah really;
and yeah thats b/c in Georgia...well you kno....less literacy and such, no offense to any southerners on here
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Old June 12th, 2006, 04:05 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Owner says "English only" and under fire

Alice-I don't think it's a 'big deal' but it can be really frustrating to try and communicate with someone who does not speak English or very, very little English. We are a U Haul dealer, and I can't tell you how many times I have wanted to pull my hair out after taking 30 minutes to first figure out what they were saying/wanted and then make them understand what I was saying. And it makes it even harder when you have 3 other people who are waiting for this to finish.
I think that if you are going to come here and take advantage of the oportunities you are allowed in the US, then you should learn English. Most of the people I deal with can write english, but can't speak it. If you can take the time to learn how to write it, take the time to learn how to say it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInWonderland
hahahahaha ^ yeah really;
and yeah thats b/c in Georgia...well you kno....less literacy and such, no offense to any southerners on here
No offense...seriously, McDonald's does have a picture menu. I guess it really is for the people who can't read...they also have a braille menu...
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Old June 12th, 2006, 04:08 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Owner says "English only" and under fire

Do the blind people stand on the counter, reach up and grope the menu?
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Old June 12th, 2006, 04:11 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: Owner says "English only" and under fire

This is a little off topic, but is there some sort of standard about the placement of braille signs in public? See, I don't understand how in the world the blind are supposed to find the signs (which in my area seem to be very small) unless there is some sort of code so that they all know where to 'look'.

Back on topic, in the end he's probably only going to hurt his own business and it sounds like he's comfortable with that - so more power to him. I can't comprehend living in a country and not learning the native or common language(s), it just seems like common sense to me. I don't think it's an 'American Respect' thing, it's just that communication in any community is key.
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Old June 12th, 2006, 04:19 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: Owner says "English only" and under fire

[quote=cloud I don't think it's an 'American Respect' thing, it's just that communication in any community is key.[/QUOTE]

ITA-it just makes things so much easier if all involved speak the same language-or some intelligible variation of it.
My sister manages the lab in a large hospital, and when they have someone (sorry but usually Spanish speaking) in that can't speak or understand English, they have this service that they call and they translate...can be very time consuming, but needed. They had a man one day before this system was started and tried to explain to him that they needed a urine sample. He nodded, and they thought he understood-low and behold he starts to pull his penis out right then and there for the urine sample...
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Old June 12th, 2006, 04:46 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: Owner says "English only" and under fire

It's Geno's
If you pause between words too long they send you away...lol.

Seriously though,
How many languages ARE food servers supposed to know?
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Old June 12th, 2006, 04:48 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: Owner says "English only" and under fire

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimmlok
Do the blind people stand on the counter, reach up and grope the menu?
no, they hump it.
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Old June 12th, 2006, 04:49 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: Owner says "English only" and under fire

Quote:
Originally Posted by AliceInWonderland
that is such a rude ass sign; if you can tell that someone speaks another language and so do you then why not speak it; jesus christo! what is w/ the english only shit anyways; its so ridiculous!

when i'm w/ someone who speaks spanish and so does our waiter they order in spanish; big fuck me deal ppl!
I think the sign is very rude as well like America is to exclude anyone who does not speak English. The owner could have chosen more gentle words like "Our wait-staff only speaks English so please order in English" or something like that.
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