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Thread: Jennifer Lopez - LATINA - October 2006

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by stargal View Post
    I think Jennifer is a lot more self conscious. I think she is embarrassed that her Spanish isn't perfect and I agree that she is too scared to go on those Latin shows. She is afraid of being ripped apart. You can tell that she doesn't have much confidence with the language and so on.
    You know who else I saw on the show OTRO ROLLO? Kevin James and Will Smith...and they were both speaking Spanish!! Of course, their Spanish was heavily accented but it was really cute. They had a blast and they were interracting with the audience. I give credit to stars like that who really try and reach all their fans all over the world. Ricky Martin was on it once and he was so funny. He was making tortillas for the audience.

    Don't you notice how Jennifer Lopez never goes to the latin awards shows anymore and she never does Spanish media television? I think you are right that J.Lo is a lot more self-conscience because her Spanish is bad. Here she tries to come across as this latino bombshell who's so proud of her heritage and of being Puerto Rican when she doesn't even live in Puerto Rico, doesn't own land there and isn't even confident speaking the language! And yet other American stars who don't even know Spanish go on these shows because they want to reach out internationally to all their fans.

    Jennifer Lopez managed to fool the American public that she's the epitome of a 'hot latina woman'. How, I'll never know, but she's not fooling anyone in hispanic countries. There are women with bigger asses, better voices, more talent and more fluent than she is in Spanish...and I'm sorry to say that but I think she knows it too and that's why she stays safely in Hollywood where she can keep the title of 'hot latina'. She has no competition there.

  2. #17
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    But it isn't her fault if her Spanish is 'bad', really (you know I don't think it is so bad). It's her parents' fault for not teaching it to her properly. From what I've heard she was practically banned from speaking it as a child. I mean I do think a person who is proud of being Latin should learn the language for sure, but it is damn near impossible to speak a language perfectly when you weren't raised speaking it. Look at Shakira - she's extremely intelligent and motivated and learned English basically for her career. She speaks very well for a Colombian girl but you would never, ever mistake her for a native speaker. And that is someone with a gift for language. You know, Jennifer could decide to speak nothing but Spanish from now on and after 6 months she'd probably STILL be making mistakes. Like I said, her English isn't so great either. She makes a ton of mistakes native speakers don't usually make. My mom, who is British, assumed that English wasn't her first language!

    I think it's kind of a vicious circle for Jennifer. Her Spanish isn't perfect, so she's afraid to use it, so it never becomes perfect. People DO have higher expectations of her because she's Hispanic, even though she was raised speaking English. Will Smith speaks worse than her, yet everyone thinks it's great because he's a black guy and they don't expect him to know any and therefore think his Spanish is a lot better than it really is. That's the impression I get. What more do you want Jennifer to do? She knows her Spanish isn't great, she has made an effort to improve it, she obviously uses it in her daily life (did you see her on Ellen a while back? She was translating for her godfather who speaks no English) How much better do you think she can be? I can't imagine her ever speaking like a Telemundo newscaster. I think her Spanish on Primer Impacto is as close to fluent she can ever get.

    Oh I found Christina's interview on Otro Rollo. We must have seen 2 different interviews because in this one she doesn't speak a WORD of Spanish! Not one word. She doesn't understand any either, the whole interview is with simultaneous translation. So I don't know how you got the idea she spoke Spanish. Of course she wasn't afraid to go on the show, she got to speak English
    Last edited by stargal; September 17th, 2006 at 08:30 PM.

  3. #18
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    It isn't her fault? Vicious circle? My God, you are a true, die-hard J.Lo fan! No wonder you're slapping down every explanation I'm giving you. You idoloze this woman...lol It is not vicious to expect a woman who markets herself as a proud latina to speak the language and to speak it well. How many times do I have to say that? I say it in all these forms and you don't get it. You're making excuses for her...she doesn't have to know Spanish. She grew up here. But if she's going to be saying in every American interview "I'm a proud Puerto Rican" and "I love Puerto Rico" and I love everything latin, then why doesn't she learn the language? Quit trying to make yourself into something you're not. It IS her fault, give me a break! She's 37 years old, she's an adult. At that age you can't blame her parents "Oh, it's her parents' fault she doesn't know Spanish well". That's bull. She doesn't speak it well because she's lazy. She's too busy marrying and dating all these men, making movies, making crappy CD's, using her latino label to sell her products and her clothes, but she won't even go on Spanish t.v.shows? It's hypocritical. She's no more latin than Ben Affleck. They learn a few words in Spanish and is he going around saying he's latin? No. But Jennifer Lopez is...It's an insult to us. You may not see that because it's not big deal to you, but for many it is a joke. She is an American star. She should be like Jessica Alba who says basically "My family is from Mexico and I'm latin, but I don't speak the language and I'm pretty much American". Speak the truth. Don't be fake.

    Jennifer's a star here, but in latin America they do not see her the way she's revered here...and people who idolize her are people who probably don't know much about it, they just adore her, period. There is sooo much talent in latino America...beautiful women...great singers...awesome actors...it's amazing how she got famous because she's not that talented. She just got a hell of a lot of press after that Selena movie.

    Will Smith doesn't need to learn Spanish. But she's not using 'latino-ness' as a meal ticket. He's not saying "I"m a proud latino" or trying to portray himself as such. It doesn't matter if he's black. There are a lot of black latinos. It's admirable that he has shown interest in speaking a language he doesn't reallly have to learn.

    Shakira....Salma Hayek....Antonio Banderas....Ricardo Montalban....Anthony Quinn...Penelope Cruz...these are a few artists who are/were truly international stars and were truly bilingual. They were/are accessible to both the American and Latin media and they didn't and don't shy away from either language. I find that admirable. They embraced both cultures. That to me a true star. I think Jennifer Lopez is a mediocre celebrity at best...she was a trend. But I don't see her as being hispanic. She's an American actress with a lot of crappy formula pictures who got famous because of her private life (marriages) the way Britney Spears did. They're more famous because of their private life than their work.

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    I don't idolize her at all. I don't even think she is that great of an actress at all, or singer. But to say she 'doesn't speak any Spanish' is laughable. Just laughable. She DOES speak Spanish, and you obviously have such an agenda that you just won't accept it. I have already told you the number of people who speak worse Spanish that her, including the girl who talks on a god damn RADIO SHOW in Spanish. Her Spanish isn't good at all but she tries her best. I heard her explain on air that her parents never really taught her any, but she's trying to learn it now because she's a proud Hispanic. Why is that OK, yet Jennifer is lazy and ignorant?

    Your arguments are so flawed it's just laughable, honey. If you detest this woman so much you refuse to see reason, say so. Don't tell me downright LIES about other people to make her look worse. I saw that Christina Aguilera interview for myself, and she didn't speak a WORD of Spanish. She doesn't speak the language at all, yet she made a Spanish CD. I don't see you calling her a fake who is calling herself Latin to sell more records. Everything you said about Christina on Otro Rollo was a lie, I guess just because you didn't want to admit she made a Spanish CD without even knowing the language. She doesn't speak OR understand anything. I guess YOU must be a diehard fan if you're willing to invent entire scenarios to prove how well she speaks Spanish, despite 'only being half Hispanic.' You know, I like Christina, I've been a fan for a long time, but I have more of a problem with her making an entire Spanish CD and not bothering to learn a single word, than with Jennifer Lopez not speaking it flawlessly.

    I could tell you until I'm blue in the face that it isn't possible for an adult to learn perfect, accent-less Spanish but you never listen, so why waste my time? None of the Latin celebrities you mentioned speak perfect English, so what point are you trying to make? I'm not the biggest Jennifer fan but thank God I am mature enough not to make up lies to prove my points. There are a lot of negative things you can say about her other than pick on the fact she doesn't speak Spanish. She DOES speak it, which is why I posted in the first place to say so, but you obviously expect superhuman miracles of her. And since you keep insisting she never does any Spanish media - in the last few years I have seen her on Spanish national TV 3 or 4 times, including 2 sit down interviews, on Primer Impacto several times, on Cristina, on Cotorreando, some Mexican show I never heard of, and they're just the ones I happened to catch. I haven't seen Eva Longoria on anything. When she interviews with our Spanish channel she always does it in English, except for the occasional 'Hola, Corazon de Verano' in an American accent.

    I'm done here. From now on I'll know you just have an agenda and are willing to make up stories to prove your point. I can't take you seriously after reading that Christina stuff. Or your version of the Eva interview, which by the way is online if you want to check how wrong you were.

  5. #20
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    Agenda? You're not even making sense now. You're speaking crazy. You are only posting things that support your idolization of Jennifer. My God, blind love...lol And where did you learn Spanish? If you think that's 'good' Spanish, that choppy shit jennifer tries to pass along as Spanish, you are highly mistaken. For people who aren't fluent, maybe she can fool them but that's a joke. She is not fluent. I guarantee you that J.Lo can't even read a whole Spanish book or can't even write a paragraph in Spanish. She won't even live in Puerto Rico....the proud Puerto Rican who won't even live there. It's a joke. Now she doesn't have to do any of those things, but if she's going to be marketing herself as that, this die-hard latina, at least put your money where your mouth is...she shouldn't be fake.

    Eva speaks Spanish. But you don't idolize her so of course, you're going to say Jennifer speaks it better than her...God, that's funny. Some guy on tv talks puras mamadas, a gag on tv and you think because she didn't translate all that jibberish it's proof that she doesn't know it? Where do you get your logic from? And BTW I never said Christina knows perfect Spanish. I told you she didn't grow up in a Spanish speaking home. She was raised by a white mother and her dad wasn't there. So where are you coming across like I said she was this perfectly fluent Spanish speaking artist? She's not. I told you that. You're the one trying to give people the notion that Jennifer is so fluent and you're wrong. You're misleading people. She doesn't know it fluently and she's even said it. Why is that such an issue with you like 'Oh my God, how dare you insult my idol J.Lo!!' What agenda do you have to prove she's perfect? She's human, you know. She's not perfect. She CAN suck at some things and Spanish is one of them. Just because she can dance or act doesn't make her a master of languages. Why is that so hard for you to accept? Why do you get so insulted by it? Your'e totally blowing this out of proportion. I said these magazine pics above aren't the greatest, I don't know what the big hype is about her and you responded immediately. You just went on and on about her...how she's so pretty and she's so great...someone said something negative about 'your star' and you went on this quest to prove me wrong.

    I told you that my gripe is that if she's going to go around saying she's soooo hispanic and soooo in love with Puerto Rico and it's people she could at least try speaking the language well. She has time to make money of the hispanic community making clothes, selling perfume, selling records, but she won't even go on spanish t.v.? I think it's a sign of RESPECT to at least learn the language well for that fan base. People are endeared to that. Forget the accent, accents are irrelevent, it's knowledge of the language, the grammar. At least learn it well so you can communicate with the latino community and not be dodging interviews or Spanish media tv because of your 'fear' of the language. What's so insulting about that? It's showing respect to the people and the culture you claim to loooove so much. Put your money where your mouth is. Sheeesh.

  6. #21
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    I think it's ok that J Lo says she's a proud of being Puerto Rican, because if she didn't, there would be a bigger hell to pay. Many kids of immigrant parents weren't allowed to speak the language (case in point - my parents never taught me creole, and I'm proud to be Haitian). I dont' think it takes away from her Puerto Ricaness. She's done a lot to praise the image and profile of Puerto Ricans, so that's good I guess.

    I understand, PrettyGirl, your point of view. It's completely valid. But unless your 'rents are immigrants and you're raised in that kind of household, you might not understand about having national pride without knowing the language.

    and aren't the latin accents so varied that sometimes one country cannot understand the other? Mexicans sounds so different from Cubans, from DR, from Chile, etc.
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  7. #22
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    I'm not doing anything of the sort. All I did was disagree with your statement that Jennifer does not speak Spanish, which I still maintain is untrue. You are the one who will stoop to anything to make people believe it. Like I said before, your opinion is your opinion, but making things up to support your argument is not cool at all. Read back through your post about Christina - you said something like "between Christina's Spanish and the host's English..." - Christina doesn't HAVE any Spanish! So that was a total lie. You were leading me to believe that Christina had the balls to go on a Latin talk show and attempt to speak Spanish, which is not true at all. You were implying that her Spanish is good for someone who wasn't really raised with it, which isn't true at all. Are you denying that now?

    I said as far as I know, Eva doesn't speak Spanish very well, from what I have seen. You are the one jumping to all kinds of conclusions about who I do and don't like. It shows more about yourself than me, because I am capable of liking someone while thinking their Spanish sucks, and vice versa. My original point is that Christina and Eva Mendes and Longoria don't speak better Spanish than Jennifer, and I have yet to see any proof to the contrary. Jay Leno aside, I have seen Eva on Spanish gossip shows many times and she either speaks English or speaks Spanish badly. If I were to see an interview with Eva speaking well, I would gladly change my opinion.

    As for your question, I AM Spanish! So you can rest assured that I speak it very well. You seem to think you are the ultimate authority on the language. How do you know YOUR Spanish is so great? You are going totally off topic about Jennifer - all I had to say was that I consider your statement that she speaks no Spanish untrue. THAT IS ALL! I maintain that a person who 'does not speak Spanish' is unable to do Spanish interviews and unable to understand it perfectly. Jennifer did an interview on our national radio station Cadena Dial a few years ago, and she understood perfectly even though the presenter was Catalan and spoke very fast. Do you think Christina Aguilera could do that? She is an example of a Latin celebrity who speaks NO Spanish. Yet she recorded a Spanish album and is proud of her Latin roots? Why doesn't THAT bother you? It doesn't make any sense!

    I agree with glamazon also. I think it's a shame if kids don't speak their parents' language, but you can be proud of your roots without speaking the language. There are thousands of Italian-Americans who speak no Italian and Jewish kids who know no Hebrew. Do you have a problem with them as well? And your statement that 'she won't even live in Puerto Rico' is ridiculous. Why should she? Who are you to tell people where to live? My mother is British, so should I feel obliged to move to London and start eating fish and chips for dinner every night? Aren't I entitled to be proud of being half British without living there?

  8. #23
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    ^^I agree with you, Stargal. Imagine if J Lo marketed herself as just all American, with her obvious latina looks...everyone who is brown would call foul. (I say brown people to encompass everyone who is non-white). I dont' think there's anything wrong with J Lo marketing herself as what she is, which is Puerto RIcan/nuyorican. The accent (which I grew up around, causing native spanish speakers to say I speak with the Puerto rican accent) can be difficult to understand - the accent involves slurring of words and appropriating english words into spanish ones...(like caro for car and knockiar for to knock). But it's like odd that you must fit a certain mold in order to be latin (or black). No matter....whether or not she's speaking spanish, she's still latina at the end of the day, you know?
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    Oh PrettyGirl here are your statements about Christina, if you have already forgotten.

    Now, about Christina Aguilera, she was on the show Otro Rollo in July 2004...it was hilarious! Between her Spanish and the host's English, they did pretty good. He had to help her once in a while but she did well considering she didn't grow up in home that spoke Spanish.
    SHE DOESN'T SPEAK SPANISH! He had to help her? She didn't even attempt to speak Spanish. She spoke English, and it was translated by a woman in the studio. Did you make that up on purpose, or did you convince yourself that it really happened?

    Plus, at the time she was dating that Puerto Rican dancer and she was all into being fluent in Spanish because of him, her career and her album...she said was very eager to speak it and learn it correctly because she loved singing in Spanish as well as English and she wanted to communicate with fans from around the world. Christina seemed very bright, very driven.
    Well, she never became fluent in Spanish, and she's had a good 4 years now to do it. You seem to think that is plenty of time to be speaking like a native. Not only is she not fluent, she still doesn't speak ANY!

    Whatever Christina wants to do, she does it and she must've taken a crash course in Spanish because it took a lot of balls to go on that show. It's a looooong show too, how many hours? Two? Jennifer Lopez would never go on that show and that's a big, big show in latino America. A big venue that any artist that really wanted to be 'international' wouldn't miss.
    Yes I'm sure it did take a lot of balls for her to speak English the entire time and have a translating thing in her ear to translate the Spanish for her. That's what all the stars do when they do European TV shows. Anyone can do that, Latin or not. Your post has actually highlighted the fact that Christina went on a Latin show and made NO effort with the language at all! Imagine if Jennifer had gone on Otro Rollo and spoken English.......outrage! The woman can't win. If she went and spoke English, she would be a fake Latina who can't even speak Spanish. If she spoke Spanish, she'd be a pocha who speaks terrible Spanish. If she doesn't go on at all, she's too scared to go on because of her Spanish. Do you see? You would NEVER be happy. You are exactly the kind of critical person I hear American Latinos complaining about. What do you really want? You said yourself you have had the opportunity to spend time in Mexico as a child - most people don't have that! So you are truly bilingual - here, have a gold star. I appreciate anyone who tries with the language and manages to do interviews. Anyone, with any language, because learning a language as an adult is DIFFICULT, which you don't seem to understand. It's not a matter of just effort. I've seen kids study Spanish for a few years and never get beyond simple sentences spoken slowly. Even kids with Hispanic backgrounds.

    ^^I agree with you, Stargal. Imagine if J Lo marketed herself as just all American, with her obvious latina looks...everyone who is brown would call foul.
    Yes, exactly. For sure people would complain that she was denying her Latin roots and 'trying to be white'. People complain a lot about Jessica Alba for not identifying as Latina, and she's only half Mexican. I'm so glad I'm not a Nuyorican because you get criticism from all sides. Why do people have to be put in boxes? Why not let people be who they are? Why do so many people have a problem with a Latina who was brought up in the U.S and speaks less than perfect Spanish? Why does that make her less Latin?

  10. #25
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    Glamazon, no matter what accent, you should be able to understand Spanish from any nationality, any country..accents are never to the point where you can't understand a language. If you are fluent in that language, you understand the language. Case in point--if you're a native English speaker, totally fluent, you will undertand English from a British person or an Australian...you will know and understand them..you will know and understand English from anywhere in the globe. But a person who perhaps doesn't know English well to begin with may not be able to understand the accents...therefore, they could possibly be clueless as to what someone's saying. But that's because they're not that strong in the language to begin with...does that make sense? A person who is Chinese for example and knows minimal conversational English from the U.S. (like J.Lo knows Spanish--minimal conversational Spanish), may not understand a person from New Zealand or Australia because they are not strong in the language yet.

    Stargirl, you are speaking of two different things. If you look back at my posting history from a long time ago, I've stated that my minor in college is SPANISH. Don't tell me what I studied for years and years. Street Spanish or basic conversational Spanish is not being fluent. You're talking in circles. If I learn a few phrases in Italian or German that doesn't make me fluent. It's one thing to memorize lyrics or a script, but it's quite different to be able to actually carry a conversation. Also, it's a proven fact that if you're STRONG in your native language, if you have strong grammar skills in your native tongue and are articulate in your first language, you are more likely to master a second one. Jennifer is not what I'd call a great public speaker even in English. So why do you find it so strange that she isn't fluent? That is not so difficult to believe.

    Marc Anthony speaks PERFECT Spanish. He was raised in New York and yet he has managed to speak the language perfectly and he is always accessible to his community and the Spanish media. That is great. So is Ricky Martin. Totally fluent. He grew up in a Spanish speaking home but he learned English very young. Gloria Estefan...Cristina Saralegui...a lot of these broadcasters/reporters and journalists from Univision and Telemundo. They speak both languages fluently and they work speaking predominantly Spanish. They don't make excuses. They assimilate to the public they're serving and living amongst.

    So, you see, there are quite a few latino artists who are totally bilingual. Antonio Banderas can now carry a conversation in English and not have it be scripted. It took him years (because his English was really bad when he first started) but being married to Melanie Griffith or working in the United States has obviously helped him. I think that's really admirable.

    For the 100th time, for the people she wishes to embrace, it would be helpful and probably much more appealing to people in the latino community if she spoke Spanish and not just a few memorized lines. Just like people in the United States expect (and sometimes even demand) that people who live in our society learn English!! Get it? In this country we try to even pass laws that will force people to speak our language because they live here or they work here or they interract with us....it's the same with the latino community. If you're going to be making money off them, asking them to support you, buy your records, go to your concerts, buy your clothes, buy your perfume, etc...etc...they would like the same. For her to speak the language out of respect proves a lot. It's our common denominator...and if you don't understand that, then you're not Spanish because you know damn well that whether you're speaking to a Cuban, a Puerto Rican, a Honduran, a Mexican, whatever race, if you have a Spanish name, if you have Spanish blood, YOU ARE EXPECTED TO SPEAK THE LANGUAGE....just like here we expect people to speak English if they live here/work here, etc... Different cultures, different mentalities, but that's how it is. It doesn't make you less hispanic, but it will definitely determine how much the public will embrace you, how they view you and especially how authentic you are in their eyes.
    Last edited by PrettyGirl; September 18th, 2006 at 06:02 PM.

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    Stargirl, you are speaking of two different things. If you look back at my posting history from a long time ago, I've stated that my minor in college is SPANISH. Don't tell me what I studied for years and years. Street Spanish or basic conversational Spanish is not being fluent. You're talking in circles. If I learn a few phrases in Italian or German that doesn't make me fluent. It's one thing to memorize lyrics or a script, but it's quite different to be able to actually carry a conversation. Also, it's a proven fact that if you're STRONG in your native language, if you have strong grammar skills in your native tongue and are articulate in your first language, you are more likely to master a second one. Jennifer is not what I'd call a great public speaker even in English. So why do you find it so strange that she isn't fluent? That is not so difficult to believe.
    I'm not talking in circles, you are changing your whole slant and totally backtracking. It was me who freaking said that Jennifer wasn't a good English speaker and that's probably why she has a hard time with Spanish! That was my point! I never, ever claimed that her Spanish was perfect or native like, just that she can speak it. Call it conversational Spanish, call it street Spanish, call it what you like. But she can come to Spain and hold her own against our national talk show hosts, so as far as I'm concerned, she speaks Spanish. That is ALL I was trying to say. Her Spanish is good enough for our TV shows, if it isn't good enough for you, well too bad, I guess. Your example about the Chinese person knowing minimal English just doesn't hold up. Jennifer understands Castilian Spanish perfectly well. What is spoken on Cadena Dial certainly isn't identical to what is spoken in the Bronx and she managed fine. She got all the 'Spanish from Spain' words like 'coche' instead of 'carro', 'conducir' instead of 'manejar' etc and even used a few. She made an effort to use the 'vosotros' forms instead of the 'ustedes' ones. Nothing was dumbed down for her, they were talking very fast. The hosts even complimented her Spanish. They were impressed by how well she spoke, especially for someone not really raised using it every day.

    Why do you think you are the only one who knows about Spanish and languages? I study linguistics and I speak 4 languages. I am well aware that knowing a few sentences doesn't make you fluent. In my opinion Jennifer knows much more than 'a few sentences' and is more than able to carry on a conversation. No, I would never think she was a native speaker like Salma Hayek, but she keeps it flowing. 'Fluency' is hard to define but for some people it's the ability to make yourself understood and talk at length without pauses, even if you do make mistakes. I consider myself fluent in German because I understand everything and can speak about almost anything. My grammar isn't 100% perfect and I don't know every single word, so am I supposed to say I DON'T speak German? That just wouldn't be true.

    All the people you mentioned were raised with 2 languages, or even spoke only Spanish in the home. You just can't compare them to someone who had minimal contact with the language. Do you think they would have hired Cristina Saralegui for her show if she had learned Spanish as a teenager? No way. You are not comparing like with like. There were people at my high school who studied English and made an effort with their speaking, but they could never do as well as me on tests and the teachers would have never compared them to me, since I have been speaking English all my life and use it every day. Why don't you compare Jennifer Lopez to other people who didn't really start to use Spanish until they were older? Antonio's English isn't THAT great and he has been learning it for years, and he had a huge incentive (his career) and he has been married to Melanie for a long time. Not to mention he usually lives in the US and is immersed in the language. And still he would never pass for a native speaker. It wouldn't be possible for him at his age. My point is it's EASY to say 'so-and-so' is totally bilingual but all the people you mentioned had the advantages to learning the language as CHILDREN. That is the key.

    It's easy for you as a bilingual person to say 'if she's Puerto Rican, she should speak the language', but as you were even saying yourself at the beginning of your post, it isn't that easy. It's hard enough speaking a language you're not too comfortable with as it is, let alone on TV with thousands of people waiting for you to mess up and criticize you. I know Puerto Ricans who are too afraid to speak Spanish with their grandparents, thinking they will be laughed at for speaking it badly or with a funny accent. Have you learned another language other than Spanish at any time? If so you can surely understand how humiliating it can be. I saw one of Jennifer's first interviews on Cristina back in like 96, and the girl was embarrassed, but she was trying. Don't you think she wished her parents had just taught her Spanish? That she could just wave a magic wand and be fluent? I'm sure she still feels like that now. Her Spanish has greatly improved in the last few years which to me shows she is trying and I don't know how anyone could expect anything more.

    There is no law stating that if you have a Spanish last name you MUST speak Spanish. There are plenty of people with Spanish last names in Britain who know no Spanish, and it's not a big deal. It's just a last name. People with French last names aren't expected to be fluent in French, and so on. That feeling might be true for YOU but not for everyone. There are plenty of Hispanics in the U.S who have no knowledge of Spanish. Like I said every year we have students from the U.S with last names of Lopez and Sanchez and not a lick of Spanish. I am Spanish from SPAIN and I can tell you we don't consider ourselves part of the little club you have going. So don't tell me what I am and am not. I can tell you I feel absolutely no connection with some girl from Texas just because she has a Spanish last name. Why the hell would I? To us, people from Mexico and Peru are foreign like anyone else. We don't consider you Spanish, and what's the problem with that? You can consider yourself what you want, put yourself in whatever box you want to but why do you need to do it to everyone else? Do you feel a special bond with Brits, Irish, Australians, South Africans, New Zealanders......because you all speak English?

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    Okay, now you speak 4 languages and study linguistics?!?!?. You're a liar and you know it. That's a joke. If you studied linguistics, you wouldn't say 'street spanish' is whatever...you wouldn't say it's all the same...it is not. You're getting your panties all in a wad over how to prove how perfect your idol Jennifer is...how truly amazing she is....how fluent and greater than life she is...well, I got news for you...she's not. Even you said her Spanish was bad and that's why she's probably embarrassed to go on Spanish media shows. Now you're saying she can hold her own and she's so impressive. Make up your mind.

    When she did her Puerto Rican concert, she couldn't even speak Spanish for 5 minutes. Hasta en PUERTO RICO valio madre!!! Not even for her own people could she hold a concert in Spanish. She couldn't even speak Spanish for an entire hour in Puerto Rico. She said one or two sentences and that was it. Why are you in such denial about that? Anyone can say "Gracias!!" or "Besos!" and wave goodbye at the end of a concert and say "Adios!!" You think that's speaking Spanish??! You think that's holding their own? What a joke. I'd hate to hear your Spanish. You probably speak like her and that's why you're all defensive. Linguistics my ass...if you studied linguistics you'd be adamant about the structure of language. You'd know what's fluent or not. Just because I can say one sentence in any language doesn't make me fluent and I sure as hell wouldn't say it either.

    Well, guess what, even George Bush can learn phrases like 'Hola", "Gracias" and 'Adios" and does that mean he knows Spanish? Noooooo. You're in big-time denial about your idol's language skills...lol. Listen to her speak in English. I highly doubt that the first thing people think about when they think of J.Lo are her exceptional language skills in English. Shit, how many times have we seen her on t.v. accepting awards and she says things like "I want to thank my fans..." *giggle, giggle*...."I want to think Benny...." *giggle, giggle*.."..and I love you, baby!! Besos!!" If that's how she speaks English (her NATIVE language), what makes you think she's going to speak Spanish any better? Come on, hermana, common sense!

    It's people like you who think slang is 'okay' or it's alright to break down a language...I assume you also think gangster slang is perfect English too, huh? If some immigrant came to the U.S. and only knew "What's up dog?" and knew some street phrases but yet didn't know how to read proper English or write it, you'd think he or she was fluent also? That's disgusting. Be real.

    You know why Ricky Martin got famous here? You know why the American public liked him so much when he came out? Because he sang in English. He held interviews in English. He did concerts in English. She learned the language. He communicated with the American public. They could relate and they liked him....Same with Marc Anthony. He was already famous in salsa music and when he crossed over, he did it all the way. He didn't half-ass it and neither one of them were 'afraid' of their language skills..Spanish or English. They desrved to be stars. Jennifer Lopez has failed to do that with the latino community. She is a mega star here because people assume she's this hot latin bombshell....call her a star, but she's an American one. The latino community, people in Latin America do not revere here the way they do here. For girls in Mexico or Panama or Cuba, they're bigger fans of Paulina Rubio or Thalia or artists like that that...she's not someone they idolize like the girls here do. And there's nothing wrong with being American, but Jennifer marketed herself as sooo hispanic and yet she couldn't even learn the language? What a lazy ass. So latin and yet she doesn't even have one J.Lo boutique store in Latin America does she? Does she have one J.Lo store in Puerto Rico or Mexico or Spain? Doesn't she have one in Russia, Hong Kong and New York? What does that tell you? Latinos look at that...the media doesn't lose sleep over it, but don't expect us to worship the ground she walks on because you do, honey. Just like any American wouldn't support any artist if they didn't seem to be genuine.

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    It seems whatever man Jennifer Lopez is with at the time, that is who she is. When she was with P. Diddy, she represented herself as hip hop, when she was with Ben she wanted to appeal to the mainstream white Americans and the only reason she is representing herself as a true Latina now, is because she is with Marc Anthony.

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    Oh my God, it's like talking to a brick wall. I give up. You are totally unable to read and comprehend what is written, you invent things I never said, or even implied, you take what you want to use and ignore the rest. You're one of those people you can explain something to ten million times and they still keep going with their one track mind. I'm not asking you to agree with me, but at least UNDERSTAND what I'm saying.

    Okay, now you speak 4 languages and study linguistics?!?!?. You're a liar and you know it. That's a joke. If you studied linguistics, you wouldn't say 'street spanish' is whatever...you wouldn't say it's all the same...it is not.
    Yes, I do. You're calling ME a liar? You're ridiculous. You made up a whole story about Christina Aguilera on Otro Rollo, and I'M a liar? You show me where I said 'street Spanish' is the same as the educated Spanish found on the news. Show me where I EVER said that. I said that Jennifer Lopez, HOWEVER she speaks Spanish, had absolutely no problem understanding and being understood on Spanish radio. That is the absolute truth - I don't feel the need to invent stories to prove my point. I personally don't think her Spanish is fantastic, but she DOES speak it, and well enough for Spanish radio personalities to be impressed. So your claim that she doesn't speak it at all is bullshit. Get over yourself nena! Why do you think you know better than me, or the people who interviewed her? How dare you make assumptions about my Spanish? That is absurd. I was born in Spain and you think you speak better than me? How could you possibly? I would love to hear your Spanish, hon. You probably sound like Eva Longoria and that's NOT a compliment. If one of us speaks a horrible nasally Mexican Spanish peppered with English words, it ain't me.

    I won't even humor your ridiculous assumptions with a response. If you think George Bush and Jennifer Lopez have the same level of Spanish you need to clean out your ears. I was the one who said Jennifer's English wasn't great, so why are you telling me like it is news? If you had any knowledge whatsoever of linguistics you would know that there is prescriptive and descriptive linguistics, i.e, a whole branch of linguistics is dedicated to just observing the different styles of language without recommending a usage. But you obviously have NO clue. Of course I don't think street talk is the same as educated usage - I never said so!

    Anyone who has to resort to making up things to prove a point is just laughable. Look at your posts! You never address the topic, you rant on about God knows what and ignore me when I challenge you about something. You have a huge chip on your shoulder and it's stopping you from being objective about anything. YOU'RE the one ranting on about how Jennifer isn't Hispanic. I don't give a shit if she's famous in Latin America or not. I already told you that in Spain she's considered an American celebrity, but if she only identified as an American I bet you ten million dollars that YOU would be the first person to complain! All you have done is show what an unhealthy obsession YOU have with this woman. Look at the lengths you go to to 'prove' she can't speak Spanish. Your reasoning makes NO sense. For the millionth time, why is it alright for Christina Aguilera to make a Spanish album and not know any Spanish?

    The ONE and ONLY point I was ever trying to make was that the woman can speak Spanish. Maybe it's not up to your golden standards, but it's good enough for most of us to understand. If I were to post videos of her speaking Spanish, almost everyone would agree that she speaks the language. Why is that such a problem for you to accept? She doesn't speak it as well as you do, OK? Is that what you want, an ego boost? There you go honey. You're SO smart. It doesn't matter that I am from Spain and speak lots of languages and have qualifications in teaching and linguistics. It doesn't matter that our TV and radio personalities think her Spanish is fine. You know better, OK? Your Spanish is so much better than mine. It's not like the language originated in my country, is it? Here's a tip for you - hope you are never a Spanish teacher or anything of the sort, since apparently if you don't speak perfectly with no mistakes at all, you are wasting your time! Just forget it!

    It all boils down to the fact you can't separate qualities in a person, evidenced by the fact you keep accusing me of being Jennifer's number one fan. You know something? I don't even like her very much! I don't like her singing, I'm not crazy about her acting, and I think she's a slut. But I will happily admit that she is very attractive, and that her Spanish is OK. Can you believe that? Amazing, isn't it? I learned to think like that in around..hmm...second grade so maybe you'll get there. You know what else? I like some of Britney's songs, even though I think she's a white trash ho! Is it too much for you to process? That not liking someone doesn't mean you have to assassinate their character every time someone poses a question. I really hope you're lucky enough to have people around you less judgmental than you are and who don't only see your flaws. Or can you take it as well as you dish it out?
    Last edited by stargal; September 18th, 2006 at 08:25 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stargal View Post
    You know something? I don't even like her very much! I don't like her singing, I'm not crazy about her acting, and I think she's a slut.


    At last, something we can all agree on!

    Actually, this is the reason I don't like J.Ho: mainstream America finally recognizes a girl who looks Latina, someone little hispanic girls can look up to and possibly identify with and she completely sucks, as you pointed out above.

    Having read your empassioned posts, I think you're both right. It's a joke that J.Lo markets herself as a latina when the only latin thing about her is her skin and her last name. As a latina myself, I resent that she is supposed to represent my general background. But while it's true that she's never going to be able to speak with a perfect Spanish accent at this age, she could at least try to have her verb tenses agree. That's just laziness IMO.

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