Lil Wayne (Dwayne Carter) having yet ANOTHER baby. This makes 3 in one year. Nice

[ang]

the thing that trips me out about lil wayne is his teeth. he has diamond-encrusted crowns installed on like all of them. just seeing pics of his teeth makes my mouth hurt.

[BlameItOnVanity]

Originally Posted by LucreziaBorgia

The worst part of it all is that he is setting a horrible example for his fans, the people who want to 'be like him', and in fact do the same only with no financial support or means to support the multiple children with multiple 'baby mammas'.

I sometimes wonder (in a conspiracy theory sort of way) if the whole 'gangsta/hard rap' industry and publicity machine was created by some underground cabal of hardcore white supremacists who want to keep the black community looking as sorry and worthless as possible in order to keep racism alive and well.

I know that people here in the south have a nearly violent hatred toward the 'ghetto/thug' culture (and we're not talking just white people here) - they are blamed for the ills of government assistance fraud, violence, etc. And the sad thing is, is that for the most part it is true. It is almost as if the 'ghetto/thug/gangsta' image that they aspire to and emulate is the very thing that keeps them 'down' so to speak.

It is a sad thing, when all you have to aspire to is the mostly fabricated crap that you see on BET, in the music industry, etc. The people who are looking up to them will never see the financial gains/'respect' that they think they will. They will only see the negative side of it.

Which, in many ways I can't help but to wonder if that was the point all along.

Conspiracy theory ranting story time over, kids. Resume as normal.

i actually agree with you. not about the white supremacists conspiracy part.. but i do believe that this ghetto 'culture' is generally bringing black people down.
I get so angry when people equate being black with being ghetto. the terrible thing is that it is often black people who do this.

[purple rain]

Originally Posted by LucreziaBorgia

The worst part of it all is that he is setting a horrible example for his fans, the people who want to 'be like him', and in fact do the same only with no financial support or means to support the multiple children with multiple 'baby mammas'.

I sometimes wonder (in a conspiracy theory sort of way) if the whole 'gangsta/hard rap' industry and publicity machine was created by some underground cabal of hardcore white supremacists who want to keep the black community looking as sorry and worthless as possible in order to keep racism alive and well.

I know that people here in the south have a nearly violent hatred toward the 'ghetto/thug' culture (and we're not talking just white people here) - they are blamed for the ills of government assistance fraud, violence, etc. And the sad thing is, is that for the most part it is true. It is almost as if the 'ghetto/thug/gangsta' image that they aspire to and emulate is the very thing that keeps them 'down' so to speak.

It is a sad thing, when all you have to aspire to is the mostly fabricated crap that you see on BET, in the music industry, etc. The people who are looking up to them will never see the financial gains/'respect' that they think they will. They will only see the negative side of it.

Which, in many ways I can't help but to wonder if that was the point all along.

Conspiracy theory ranting story time over, kids. Resume as normal.

70% of black children are born to unwed mothers (not that I think you have to be married to have a child - just have a stable father figure in your child's life and be financially capable of raising a child.) There is an epidemic of black children being born to baby mamas & having no father figures in their lives (Just go to the News section, there is a story about 117 girls in an inner-city Chicago school being pregnant.) Given that fact, I think it's terrible that the likes of Lil' Wayne and NBA ballers are looked up to as role models in the black community, and that their irresponsible behavior is accepted. I don't care if Lil' Wayne has money to financially support his children (unlike most baby daddies); his behavior is still totally reckless and completely irresponsible. He needs to get a vasectomy before he impregnantes yet another woman.

[sparkly]

Originally Posted by purple rain

70% of black children are born to unwed mothers (not that I think you have to be married to have a child - just have a stable father figure in your child's life and be financially capable of raising a child.) There is an epidemic of black children being born to baby mamas & having no father figures in their lives (Just go to the News section, there is a story about 117 girls in an inner-city Chicago school being pregnant.) Given that fact, I think it's terrible that the likes of Lil' Wayne and NBA ballers are looked up to as role models in the black community, and that their irresponsible behavior is accepted. I don't care if Lil' Wayne has money to financially support his children (unlike most baby daddies); his behavior is still totally reckless and completely irresponsible. He needs to get a vasectomy before he impregnantes yet another woman.

True, but it takes 2 to tango and these women should've insisted he wear a condom. If he refused, they should've had the self respect to say no. But something tells me that having a baby with him ($$$$) is what they were after in the first place.

[kingcap72]

Originally Posted by LucreziaBorgia

The worst part of it all is that he is setting a horrible example for his fans, the people who want to 'be like him', and in fact do the same only with no financial support or means to support the multiple children with multiple 'baby mammas'.

I sometimes wonder (in a conspiracy theory sort of way) if the whole 'gangsta/hard rap' industry and publicity machine was created by some underground cabal of hardcore white supremacists who want to keep the black community looking as sorry and worthless as possible in order to keep racism alive and well.

I know that people here in the south have a nearly violent hatred toward the 'ghetto/thug' culture (and we're not talking just white people here) - they are blamed for the ills of government assistance fraud, violence, etc. And the sad thing is, is that for the most part it is true. It is almost as if the 'ghetto/thug/gangsta' image that they aspire to and emulate is the very thing that keeps them 'down' so to speak.

It is a sad thing, when all you have to aspire to is the mostly fabricated crap that you see on BET, in the music industry, etc. The people who are looking up to them will never see the financial gains/'respect' that they think they will. They will only see the negative side of it.

Which, in many ways I can't help but to wonder if that was the point all along.

Conspiracy theory ranting story time over, kids. Resume as normal.

The gangsta rap industry isn't representative of the entire black community, so a white supremacist conspiracy theory wouldn't even come into play. And let's not forget that the bulk of rap music is purchased by suburban white kids. When rap was confined to the inner city, most people could care less what it represented. But once it swept into the suburbs and the mainstream, then it became an issue.

As for Lil Wayne's dumb ass, any fan that looks to him as a role model is beyond saving.

As for people in the south having a violent hatred toward gangsta rap that's not true at all. I've seen plenty of black and white gangsta rap fans in the south. Gangsta rap definitely has its flaws, but gangsta rap reflects the problems in the inner cities it doesn't create them.

And when did black people have nothing but the crap on BET to aspire to? I grew up in the projects and, trust me, I didn't look to BET as my inspiration, even though it was a much better network before it was sold to Viacom. There are black lawyers, doctors, judges, business leaders, and as of 2009 a black Attorney General, President and First Lady to look up to. I agree that the people who look to the gangsta rappers as role models will never see the financial gain/respect, but gangsta rap's influence goes beyond the 'hood.

[NickiDrea]

^^^ Thank you!!!

I am so tired of the stereotype that gangsta rap reflects the entire black community!

[*DIVA!]

Originally Posted by kingcap72

The gangsta rap industry isn't representative of the entire black community, so a white supremacist conspiracy theory wouldn't even come into play. And let's not forget that the bulk of rap music is purchased by suburban white kids. When rap was confined to the inner city, most people could care less what it represented. But once it swept into the suburbs and the mainstream, then it became an issue.

As for Lil Wayne's dumb ass, any fan that looks to him as a role model is beyond saving.

As for people in the south having a violent hatred toward gangsta rap that's not true at all. I've seen plenty of black and white gangsta rap fans in the south. Gangsta rap definitely has its flaws, but gangsta rap reflects the problems in the inner cities it doesn't create them.

And when did black people have nothing but the crap on BET to aspire to? I grew up in the projects and, trust me, I didn't look to BET as my inspiration, even though it was a much better network before it was sold to Viacom. There are black lawyers, doctors, judges, business leaders, and as of 2009 a black Attorney General, President and First Lady to look up to. I agree that the people who look to the gangsta rappers as role models will never see the financial gain/respect, but gangsta rap's influence goes beyond the 'hood.

So eloquently put..thank you.
I grew listening to NWA and Easy-E, and I don't have a house load of kids, a criminal record, nor am I promiscuous. I don't understand how words someone says over beats could be blamed for so much.

[LucreziaBorgia]

Originally Posted by kingcap72

The gangsta rap industry isn't representative of the entire black community

I know that. You know that. Most intelligent people know that. Try telling that to your average white supremacist or garden variety racist (of which there are more than a few in this small southern town - and yes, a good deal of them do see it that way and they aren't afraid to make that clear when posting racist comments on our local newspaper website's comment sections).

As for Lil Wayne's dumb ass, any fan that looks to him as a role model is beyond saving.

Plenty of people here do idolize him - him and any number of other 'hard' individuals. Are they beyond saving? Hard to say. I don't know that many of them want to be. They want what Lil Wayne has - the ability to make it while preserving his culture and not sell out (as I've heard a few people say, anyway).

As for people in the south having a violent hatred toward gangsta rap

Woah, now - I didn't say they hated just the music - the people I'm talking about hate the culture in general (which thrives here, our small city is third largest in the state for gang activity) - some of the same people I mentioned above, who (and I'm not kidding) will post horrible stuff in "dialect" thinking they are being funny, when in fact it is some of the most blatantly racist stuff I've seen. These are the people I was mentioning before - the ones who I can see (and I mean this only in a CONSPIRACY THEORY way, not in any real way) as creating something like "the industry" to stir hatred in people like them who tar everyone with the same brush when it comes to racism. Now I know people of many races who do not like that culture, but who are not racist by a long shot. I guess that would be 'classism' rather than racism though.

And when did black people have nothing but the crap on BET to aspire to?

I didn't say it was that way for everyone - but I can guarantee you this - there are people here who do not exactly look up to lawyers, doctors, judges or business leaders - and they don't teach their children to look up to them either. Not everyone by a long shot, but there are sections of town here where a different sort of 'hero' is looked up to, because these are kids who for the most part don't even dare to dream to aspire to something better for themselves. This is a small, southern racist town that works against them at every turn. Some kids make it out of here, and go on to live the lives they want but for the most part they don't. They are having their own children before they are twenty and are repeating a terrible cycle.

There are black lawyers, doctors, judges, business leaders, and as of 2009 a black Attorney General, President and First Lady to look up to.

And I agree with you wholly, but a good deal of the kids who need these sort of role models here aren't exposed to them, and are not taught that they can aspire for more. Our public school system here wouldn't even play President Obama's speech in the schools, and in fact there were parent groups who threatened boycotting that school day and keeping their kids out of school on that day if his speech was shown. Now you have your average kid sitting there seeing this, seeing his classmates' parents' doing this and what do you think they are going to see as possible for themselves?

Never did I say that gangsta rap represents the entire black community. But I can guarantee you this: there are people out there who do think that, and they are the ones that I was pinning the 'conspiracy theory' on, and who would gladly keep that stereotype going strong. And it was just that - a conspiracy theory. I can also tell you this - I wouldn't be the only one who has wondered about that, and who gets angry at seeing generations of kids here who feel that they have no heros but the ones they see pulling the big money in the 'genre'.

I would have to say that some clarity is needed here in general - race and culture are not the same thing of course, though it may have sounded like it from my post. You can have a given race and a culture within that race that is nowhere near being representative of that race. Just as there are people who have a hatred for a given race, there are those (even members of that particular race) who of course do not hate a race but they dislike a certain culture within that race that has more to do with classism rather than racism.

Is it really so much of a stretch though to see how a conspiracy theory could come of the idea? The person who got me thinking on this in the first place is a black hip hop musician in a very popular local funk/hip hop ensemble who has a similar theory and a great hatred toward the idea of negative stereotypes in gangsta rap keeping people 'down', and he incorporates that into his shows as well.

[kingcap72]

Originally Posted by LucreziaBorgia

I know that. You know that. Most intelligent people know that. Try telling that to your average white supremacist or garden variety racist (of which there are more than a few in this small southern town - and yes, a good deal of them do see it that way and they aren't afraid to make that clear when posting racist comments on our local newspaper website's comment sections).

See, your original post didn't come off like you were saying any intelligent person would know that gangsta rap doesn't represent the entire black community. In fact, just the opposite. Because in your last post you said that gangsta rap was 'blamed for the ills of government assistance fraud, violence, etc. And the sad thing is, is that for the most part it is true.' It comes off like you're contradicting yourself from your last post to this post.

Originally Posted by LucreziaBorgia

Plenty of people here do idolize him - him and any number of other 'hard' individuals. Are they beyond saving? Hard to say. I don't know that many of them want to be. They want what Lil Wayne has - the ability to make it while preserving his culture and not sell out (as I've heard a few people say, anyway).

Let's remember that the most popular rapper in the world is white, blond and blue-eyed and his name is Eminem. And if you've ever heard any of Eminem's music, especially his earlier work, it fits right alongside much of gangsta rap. Now, Eminem had a baby out of wedlock, rapped about killing the mother of his child, and has had run-in's with the law. Eminem is seen as role model, but nobody blames Eminem when teenage white girls get pregnant or teenage white kids commit violent acts.

Originally Posted by LucreziaBorgia

Woah, now - I didn't say they hated just the music - the people I'm talking about hate the culture in general (which thrives here, our small city is third largest in the state for gang activity) - some of the same people I mentioned above, who (and I'm not kidding) will post horrible stuff in "dialect" thinking they are being funny, when in fact it is some of the most blatantly racist stuff I've seen. These are the people I was mentioning before - the ones who I can see (and I mean this only in a CONSPIRACY THEORY way, not in any real way) as creating something like "the industry" to stir hatred in people like them who tar everyone with the same brush when it comes to racism. Now I know people of many races who do not like that culture, but who are not racist by a long shot. I guess that would be 'classism' rather than racism though.

You didn't say they hated the gangsta rap 'culture' in your last post, you said they hated gangsta rap. But the point that you're missing is that gangsta rap doesn't create the violence in the inner city, it reflects it. Most gangsta rappers come from violent, poor backgrounds and that's what they rap about.

Now, my main issue with gangsta rap is that the people who are making millions off of exploiting the inner city aren't doing anything to fix the problems.

Originally Posted by LucreziaBorgia

I didn't say it was that way for everyone - but I can guarantee you this - there are people here who do not exactly look up to lawyers, doctors, judges or business leaders - and they don't teach their children to look up to them either. Not everyone by a long shot, but there are sections of town here where a different sort of 'hero' is looked up to, because these are kids who for the most part don't even dare to dream to aspire to something better for themselves. This is a small, southern racist town that works against them at every turn. Some kids make it out of here, and go on to live the lives they want but for the most part they don't. They are having their own children before they are twenty and are repeating a terrible cycle.

Whatever problems are going on in your town, or any other inner city environment, can't be laid at the feet of gangsta rap. That's a reflection of bad parenting, not the music. And the issue of teen pregnancy and teen violence isn't just confined to blacks anymore, but it gets the most attention.

Originally Posted by LucreziaBorgia

And I agree with you wholly, but a good deal of the kids who need these sort of role models here aren't exposed to them, and are not taught that they can aspire for more. Our public school system here wouldn't even play President Obama's speech in the schools, and in fact there were parent groups who threatened boycotting that school day and keeping their kids out of school on that day if his speech was shown. Now you have your average kid sitting there seeing this, seeing his classmates' parents' doing this and what do you think they are going to see as possible for themselves?

I was never really taught that I should aspire for more when I was in public school, but that didn't stop me from wanting to aspire for more. Because my parents drilled that into me from an early age. So, if the blacks kids are stuck in a racist school system, then it falls upon the parents to step up and take the lead.

I'll be the first to say that in the inner city too many young kids aspire to only be athletes or entertainers and that needs to change. But, once again, that ultimately falls on the parents.

Originally Posted by LucreziaBorgia

Never did I say that gangsta rap represents the entire black community. But I can guarantee you this: there are people out there who do think that, and they are the ones that I was pinning the 'conspiracy theory' on, and who would gladly keep that stereotype going strong. And it was just that - a conspiracy theory. I can also tell you this - I wouldn't be the only one who has wondered about that, and who gets angry at seeing generations of kids here who feel that they have no heros but the ones they see pulling the big money in the 'genre'.

I would have to say that some clarity is needed here in general - race and culture are not the same thing of course, though it may have sounded like it from my post. You can have a given race and a culture within that race that is nowhere near being representative of that race. Just as there are people who have a hatred for a given race, there are those (even members of that particular race) who of course do not hate a race but they dislike a certain culture within that race that has more to do with classism rather than racism.

Is it really so much of a stretch though to see how a conspiracy theory could come of the idea? The person who got me thinking on this in the first place is a black hip hop musician in a very popular local funk/hip hop ensemble who has a similar theory and a great hatred toward the idea of negative stereotypes in gangsta rap keeping people 'down', and he incorporates that into his shows as well.

And, yes, it is a stretch to say that there was some conspiracy behind gangsta rap, especially when you consider the origins of gangsta rap. Gangsta rap represents violence, misogny against women and money, the three cornerstones of American society. Our society is a violent society, represented by what we see in the movies and on T.V. Women are treated like sex objects in various corners of our society and Americans love money and fancy things. People love to blame gangsta rap for those things, but it's only reflecting the society that conceived it.

And you didn't have to say gangsta rap represented the entire community. But this quote came across as if you were talking about the entire community:

I sometimes wonder (in a conspiracy theory sort of way) if the whole 'gangsta/hard rap' industry and publicity machine was created by some underground cabal of hardcore white supremacists who want to keep the black community looking as sorry and worthless as possible in order to keep racism alive and well.

[LucreziaBorgia]

My point was simple: there are people out there who generalize and see only one part of a given culture as a representative of a whole. If they are racist and they want to bring down the other race, all they have to do is highlight that one negative cultural thing and convince others that it is representative of the race in general in order to make the entire race look bad.

If someone wanted to stretch that and make a conspiracy theory out of it, then they easily could.

The details and examples, well - we all read things how we want them to say, I guess.

Because in your last post you said that gangsta rap was 'blamed for the ills of government assistance fraud, violence, etc. And the sad thing is, is that for the most part it is true.'

This is from my original post. I didn't mention music of any sort.

I know that people here in the south have a nearly violent hatred toward the 'ghetto/thug' culture (and we're not talking just white people here) - they are blamed for the ills of government assistance fraud, violence, etc. And the sad thing is, is that for the most part it is true. It is almost as if the 'ghetto/thug/gangsta' image that they aspire to and emulate is the very thing that keeps them 'down' so to speak.

That culture (and it is not limited to any one race, nor are they hated by any one race) is blamed for the ills of government assistance fraud, and around here that is largely the case given the people who are busted for it (and again, it isn't any one race that is busted, but members of a certain culture regardless of skin color) - but I will say it again - it isn't a race thing - it is a class thing in this case.

But, if someone wanted to make it about race, they could skew the facts, exaggerate some things, downplay others and make it about race and try to make everyone of that race look bad - regardless of what race it is. Hence, the conspiracy theory.

...to keep the black community looking as sorry and worthless as possible in order to keep racism alive and well.

That isn't my view so much as it was me saying that the sort of person who would conspire against a race will stop at nothing to make sure that everyone in a given race is measured by the most negative thing they can come up with.

[kingcap72]

Originally Posted by LucreziaBorgia

My point was simple: there are people out there who generalize and see only one part of a given culture as a representative of a whole. If they are racist and they want to bring down the other race, all they have to do is highlight that one negative cultural thing and convince others that it is representative of the race in general in order to make the entire race look bad.

If someone wanted to stretch that and make a conspiracy theory out of it, then they easily could.

The details and examples, well - we all read things how we want them to say, I guess.

I'm not disagreeing that people can't try to misrepresent an entire culture. That's a given. I just didn't agree with some of the points that you used to illustrate that point.

Originally Posted by LucreziaBorgia

his is from my original post. I didn't mention music of any sort.

Gangsta rap IS music, so when you mentioned it you were talking about music. But I see that you mentioned culture as well.

Originally Posted by LucreziaBorgia

That culture (and it is not limited to any one race, nor are they hated by any one race) is blamed for the ills of government assistance fraud, and around here that is largely the case given the people who are busted for it (and again, it isn't any one race that is busted, but members of a certain culture regardless of skin color) - but I will say it again - it isn't a race thing - it is a class thing in this case.

But, if someone wanted to make it about race, they could skew the facts, exaggerate some things, downplay others and make it about race and try to make everyone of that race look bad - regardless of what race it is. Hence, the conspiracy theory.

That isn't my view so much as it was me saying that the sort of person who would conspire against a race will stop at nothing to make sure that everyone in a given race is measured by the most negative thing they can come up with.

Welfare fraud has existed longer than gangsta rap culture, so how can it be blamed for it? I get some of the points that you're making, but your original post didn't really spell those points out.

[Hung]

He is weed smoking, irresposible thug or (gansta his words) that has a bucket full of money.

Hung