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Thread: Documentary Accusing Michael Jackson of Sexually Abusing Boys to Premiere at Sundance

  1. #136
    czb
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    i only made it through 30 minutes of the first part.

    the parents were too annoying to me. i just can't imagine letting MJ or any adult that wasn't a family member have access to my kids like that.
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    Agree. The parents were positively basking and blinded in the rich and famous lifestyle MJ offered them in return for unlimited access to their sons.

    Another thing I noticed in the docco was that MJs kids weren’t even mentioned. Nor his fake marriage to their mother(s) although it did briefly cover the laughable marriage to Lisa Marie Presley. I know it was primarily about the sexual abuse of very young boys, but it would have given some useful background, especially the timing.
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    We had it on in the kitchen for a while, and I agree with what CZB is saying. The parents basically let Jackson into their kids' lives in a huge way. When I stopped watching, the Safechuck mom was talking about how Jackson would show up at their home, walk through their door and say, "I love the Safechucks!" And then spend the night. I get being starstruck but come on.......

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    Quote Originally Posted by A*O View Post
    Agree. The parents were positively basking and blinded in the rich and famous lifestyle MJ offered them in return for unlimited access to their sons.

    Another thing I noticed in the docco was that MJs kids weren’t even mentioned. Nor his fake marriage to their mother(s) although it did briefly cover the laughable marriage to Lisa Marie Presley. I know it was primarily about the sexual abuse of very young boys, but it would have given some useful background, especially the timing.
    I think the documentary producers sad this was not meant to be a Michael Jackson story but rather the stores of two survivors of sexual abuse? Just a thought why the kids wouldnt be mentioned .

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    Elite Member crayzeehappee's Avatar
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    I watched most of the first part last night. I have a little bit to go on it, but I needed to stop for the night because I needed a break. It was very tough to watch. It was quite creepy when it was going over how he began gaining access to the kids and growing closer to them, and all of that, but once it got into the sexual abuse... My Gawd. It was very upsetting, to say the least. Their reactions and stories seemed incredibly genuine to me. I just do not understand the mindset of those parents. At all. I get they were dazzled, but come on. And seeing the pics and video of them as young children was very sad.
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  6. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by A*O View Post
    Agree. The parents were positively basking and blinded in the rich and famous lifestyle MJ offered them in return for unlimited access to their sons.

    Another thing I noticed in the docco was that MJs kids weren’t even mentioned. Nor his fake marriage to their mother(s) although it did briefly cover the laughable marriage to Lisa Marie Presley. I know it was primarily about the sexual abuse of very young boys, but it would have given some useful background, especially the timing.
    well, the part i watched (and i think that covered how the 2 boys met michael), it was during BAD. and that was late 80s. so maybe before MJ had kids? i'm sure someone here could google.

    what i just saw was that parents were starstruck and easily bought. squee! we got to go to hawaii!!! i felt a pit in my stomach. as much as i would love to have a free stay at the ritz on the big island, i ain't gonna sell access to my kids. i remember i used to go rabid when i would walk into the market with the stroller and try to pull away the cloth so they could see my newborns. NO.
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    Quote Originally Posted by czb View Post
    i only made it through 30 minutes of the first part.

    the parents were too annoying to me. i just can't imagine letting MJ or any adult that wasn't a family member have access to my kids like that.
    I am watching it now on ON DEMAND...not to give the parents and grandparents a pass, but they were starstruck and manipulated by MJ; he knew the effect he had on people and he used it to sprinkle pixie dust in their eyes while he diddled their children. Shit, I'm sitting here tapping my feet to Michael's music watching this.
    "To be [black] in this country and to be relativity conscious is to be in a rage almost all of the time." ~ James Baldwin

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    Quote Originally Posted by A*O View Post
    Agree. The parents were positively basking and blinded in the rich and famous lifestyle MJ offered them in return for unlimited access to their sons.

    Another thing I noticed in the docco was that MJs kids weren’t even mentioned. Nor his fake marriage to their mother(s) although it did briefly cover the laughable marriage to Lisa Marie Presley. I know it was primarily about the sexual abuse of very young boys, but it would have given some useful background, especially the timing.
    The kids were mentioned in the documentary. Wade mentioned them as one of the reasons he testified for Michael in the 2005 trial. Said he was having dinner with the whole family and Paris was stroking her dad's back, trying to cheer him up, something like that and it made him feel terrible about the possibility of MJ going to jail. He also mentioned seeing them in 2008 in Las Vegas, the last time he saw Michael when he got super drunk and just left them alone in the living room. And I'm pretty sure that earlier there is a mention of the marriage to Debbie Rowe and how she was pregnant with MJ's kid.
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    Elite Member MohandasKGanja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BITTER View Post
    I am watching it now on ON DEMAND...not to give the parents and grandparents a pass, but they were starstruck and manipulated by MJ; he knew the effect he had on people and he used it to sprinkle pixie dust in their eyes while he diddled their children. Shit, I'm sitting here tapping my feet to Michael's music watching this.
    I'm listening to "Human Nature" by Jackson. Probably my all-time favorite song by him. I think older people like me have a lot of songs that they not only enjoy but they are inextricably intertwined with important times in their lives. He sounds like a horrible person from what I'm hearing in the documentary, but I will love that song until the day I die.

  10. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by MohandasKGanja View Post
    I'm listening to "Human Nature" by Jackson. Probably my all-time favorite song by him. I think older people like me have a lot of songs that they not only enjoy but they are inextricably intertwined with important times in their lives. He sounds like a horrible person from what I'm hearing in the documentary, but I will love that song until the day I die.
    I heard someone say that they're just going to say they're a fan of Quincy Jones from now on.

    MJ is in kind of a hard place when it comes to canceling a celebrity. I realized when the John Wayne Playboy interview was rediscovered that I don't think there's much point in canceling a dead celebrity. They're not affected by your shaming and they've already made their mark on culture and society. As a fan of TCM, I've had to inure myself to the fact that many of the films I enjoy were made by people with whom I would vehemently disagree or who were even outright monsters. Erroll Flynn was a sexual predator and a literal slave trader, Alfred Hitchcock sexually harassed and abused Tippi Hedron, and Joan Crawford abused her daugter, but they've all been subjects of TCM tributes due to their influence in film. Errol Flynn and his victims are dead, and Afred Hitchcock and Joan Crawford's victims have been given their voices, so I guess people don't feel too bad just enjoying the work that they produced, while also acknowledging their terrible behavior.

    MJ's not been dead for very long, his victims are still in their prime, and the people who enabled MJ's predation could still be profiting off of his legacy and sales. I think it's important to refuse to contribute in any way to his legacy/estate monetarily, make it absolutely clear that his behavior is completely unacceptable, and give his victims what justice they can get. However, I don't think his music will be canceled. It's too big. We have a strong sense of social justice right now, so it might be dampened for awhile. There might even be a culture clash between those who believe the victims and think it's in bad taste to play his music publicly and those who defend him and play his music to piss off the haters.

    I've not yet listened to any of his songs since watching what little I could of the documentary (I distracted myself on my phone and eventually turned it off when it got too graphic), and don't know whether what I know now will affect my experience when listening to them. Some people are better at compartmentalizing than others.

  11. #146
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    I heard my all time fave MJ song on the radio this day (One Day In Your Life) and I got a bit teary, partly because it has a special meaning for me anyway, but also because he released it before he fucked up his looks and his life and it could have been so very different.
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    I heard someone say that they're just going to say they're a fan of Quincy Jones from now on.
    I'm tempering my POV of him as well...he's no saint either.
    "To be [black] in this country and to be relativity conscious is to be in a rage almost all of the time." ~ James Baldwin

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    I'm going to be in the minority here...

    I don't know 100% whether or not Michael Jackson was a child molester. And actually, up until this documentary, I did 100% believe he was a child molester. I'm not a fan of Michael Jackson and never was or will be, but I watched the Leaving Neverland documentary and I don't know, something just seemed suspicious, especially about that Wade Robson guy. Since watching it, I have read and watched a lot about this guy. The more I read/saw the more I just question everything about him. He was all about Michael Jackson until his career started going downhill and was turned down by the family estate to be the director of the Michael Jackson Cirque Du Soleil show.

    For every side of a story, there is always another, and that's obviously true with this documentary. A lot of what he claims about his entire life with Jackson can be disproved. I think that Robson is certainly embellishing his truth for monetary gain. I just don't believe him about being molested by Jackson. Jimmy Safechuck...? Maybe, I don't know. He does seem more believable than Robson, that's for sure. Although, I do find it strange that they both had the exact same experiences with Jackson, and the exact same sexual molestation realizations; both not realizing what they were doing was wrong until they both had children. They are telling the exact same story.

    Since watching that documentary, I have become fascinated with it and I've no idea why. I do wonder why a grown man was spending so much of his time with children, but also wonder why, with all the children he has spent time with, why only 4 cases of molestation have been brought forward. The 1st being a lie (admitted by the kid), one Michael Jackson being cleared on 14 counts (I think it was 14) some of which were misdemeanors, which you think he would have at least got pegged on for one or 2. Now it's these 2 guys, one of which has been lying one way or another for 20 years.

    As I said, Michael Jackson could very well be a child molester, but I have serious doubt that Wade Robson was one of them.

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    I think that had anyone else continually and publicly behaved around children the way Jackson did their career would have been toast long before the OD. There were enough red flags around him to have a Communist parade and had this been an ordinary guy he would have been on the Register and living in an approved and monitored community before he had time to squeak out a Hee-hee and drop a Moonwalk.

    As for why there aren't more accusers, not all victims want to go on record. More sexual assaults aren't reported than are and when you throw money, power, fame and a truly insane fan base I can understand why others may choose to keep quiet and just try to live their lives as best as they can.
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    I have watched both parts of the series plus the Oprah special and I believe everything these men have said regarding their relationships with Michael Jackson and the abuse. It is apparent to me that both felt such an attachment to Jackson that he was at one time closer than family to them. He was in part lover/protector/parent/god to these boys by his own doing. His genius extended to being a master manipulator. The boys didn't come forward due to a bond of loyalty so strong it pervaded their lives for many years.

    It seems they disassociated from the sexual abuse almost for fear of accidentally outing Jackson and breaking that bond of loyalty. It looks like they buried it deep and it was only the strength of the bond they felt with their own sons that made it bubble to the surface. As Wade said, if he never had a son he doesn't know if he would ever have woken up and spoken up. I feel horrified that this happened in plain site. It reminds me a bit of Jimmy Saville actually.
    Kittylady, Mivvi21, fgg and 3 others like this.

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