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Thread: Muslim?

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by A*O View Post
    I have not studied Islam in any great depth (perhaps I should) - I am just giving my personal views on how your religion is perceived by a non-Muslim. People associate Islam with the 'radical wingnuts' because they are invariably Islamic/religious 'spokesmen', not ordinary secular Muslims with no religious agenda. Is there such thing? Maybe that's the problem.
    But they are so many fundamentalist radical wingnuts 'spokesmen' in all religions.

    Of course there is secular Muslims with no agenda. I am one for one. There is a lot of secular Muslims in he Middle East who go on about their everyday lives and spokesmen as they are influential people because some of them ar writers, journalists, leaders,etc... I just do not understand why the West likes to associate a small percentage of fundamentalist crazies as a representation of the 2 billion Muslims worldwide.

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    Because the crazies bring worldwide attention to themselves and their cause (worldwise Islamification) by doing crazy things!! I expect if a group of Mormon fundamentalists organised a campaign of suicide bombings or other random acts of carnage then people would have the same opinion of the Mormon religion as a whole. I know that the vast majority of Muslims ARE peaceful, law abiding citizens - I don't understand why they don't organise themselves to shut out, and shut down, the tiny minority of mad extremists within their ranks who are giving the whole of Islam such a bad reputation.
    If all the women in this place were laid end to end, I wouldn’t be surprised - Dorothy Parker

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hazeleyed_Honey View Post
    But they are so many fundamentalist radical wingnuts 'spokesmen' in all religions.

    Of course there is secular Muslims with no agenda. I am one for one. There is a lot of secular Muslims in he Middle East who go on about their everyday lives and spokesmen as they are influential people because some of them ar writers, journalists, leaders,etc... I just do not understand why the West likes to associate a small percentage of fundamentalist crazies as a representation of the 2 billion Muslims worldwide.
    it's how well the public eye knows them as well...take the Jewish religion for example, if you ask someone who isn't Jewish they'll probably know very little. How do you spell Hannukah? Is there a C? Even a person here was confused if jewish people did or did not circumsize. Is there a Jewish heaven? Not everyone knows this...

    Ask someone about the Muslim race however, and they'll reply with all that fear crap they got from television and the news.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by A*O View Post
    Because the crazies bring worldwide attention to themselves and their cause (worldwise Islamification) by doing crazy things!! I expect if a group of Mormon fundamentalists organised a campaign of suicide bombings or other random acts of carnage then people would have the same opinion of the Mormon religion as a whole. I know that the vast majority of Muslims ARE peaceful, law abiding citizens - I don't understand why they don't organise themselves to shut out, and shut down, the tiny minority of mad extremists within their ranks who are giving the whole of Islam such a bad reputation.
    That is another great misconception by the West.That these fundamentalists want to "Islamify" the whole world. Nowhere have I read where they want to make everyone Muslim. I think it is deep-rooted in having to do more with a political context as in they are against Western foreign policies. That still does not give them an excuse for their suicide bombings,but I think that is what is behind their intentions and not worldwide Islamification.

    Actually, no,usually it is when some Muslim follower who is a fundamentalist crazy psychopath that initiates violence then right away that is associated with being Islamic or the Muslim religion.

    You need to look no further than the Bush administration in which the Christian evanligical groups are behind the Bush Republican administration. His administration has spread violence and carnage in other countries in which they have killed in TOTAL more people than these fundamental crazy Muslim followers have,and no one says zip and does not associate Christianity with their actions. So,yes,there is absolutely a double standard.

    How do you expect Muslims to shut out these crazy mental fundamentalists in their community?Muslims are victims of these fundamentalists themselves. Al-Qaeda and other fundamentalist terrorist cells have bombed and targeted Muslm nations like Morocco, Egypt, Indonesia (Bali), Saudi Arabia, Lebanon, Iraq. In which they have killed more people in their Islamic nations than in the West. So,Muslims are struggling with terorrist actions not only from Al-Qaeda but also from Western governments. They get the worst end of the stick. That is my whole point, there is definetly a double standard against Islam in the western media,and that goes way back to history in why this is the case.

    All it comes down to here is that this is all about the issue of representation. In the West, the eastern hemisphere is depicted as "the Other" and as inferior. If you notice, the powerful Western nations tend to be in wars with nations from the eastern hemisphere. That is how the West identifies itself, with what it is not. The West need these kind of wars like the Cold War, "War on Terror",etc...to keep its power in siding itself against the other. In this world and age, it is also the natons with the most power that get to represent and define others since they have the means to. Thus, in this case, the West depicts Islam in this negative light since they have the advantage to. History is written by the victors.

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    But my point is that the only high profile Muslims making the news worldwide ARE the crazies and people base their opinions on that. It's probably the western media's fault that this is so, but you asked what the 'western' perception of Muslims is and, right or wrong, I gave my opinion. I don't agree with that perception, but that's how it is unfortunately.

    And I would genuinely like to know what, exactly, the extremist fundamentalists do actually WANT to achieve? If their gripe was purely historical/political why don't secular Muslims campaign for less western interference? It's always the religious nutters - so of course people will link terrorism with Islam.
    If all the women in this place were laid end to end, I wouldn’t be surprised - Dorothy Parker

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    Quote Originally Posted by A*O View Post
    But my point is that the only high profile Muslims making the news worldwide ARE the crazies and people base their opinions on that. It's probably the western media's fault that this is so, but you asked what the 'western' perception of Muslims is and, right or wrong, I gave my opinion. I don't agree with that perception, but that's how it is unfortunately.
    I get what you are saying. Yes, it is probably just the western media focusing on the fundamental extremists and giving them the main coverage. It is just like how in American movies, you sometimes have the Asians portrayed as the bad guys or people of another ethnicity. Or even the way sometimes blacks are portrayed in American media is by the negative stereotypes.

    And I would genuinely like to know what, exactly, the extremist fundamentalists do actually WANT to achieve? If their gripe was purely historical/political why don't secular Muslims campaign for less western interference? It's always the religious nutters - so of course people will link terrorism with Islam.
    What these radical wingnuts want is to islamicize the Middle East. They want the Middle Eastern governments to be under an Islamic republic and constitution,a more strict one. Like for example, even though Saudi Arabia is a strict Wahabi state, they are allies with the U.S.,and these radical fundamentalists want U.S. presence out of Middle Eastern affairs. That is even what Osama has implied about his savage cause.

    These radical wingnuts want Western interference in the Middle East to halt to a stop. They want them to stop mingling in their affairs. That is why they attacked the U.S. and somewhere like Britain and other Western provinces. They do not care to islamicize the West,they do not want to convert everyone to Islam. In the Middle East,there is Christians and Muslims who live amongst each other.They just want the Arab middle Eastern governments to stop being allies with western governments.

    Well,Arabs do not want western interference or even influence in the Middle East region. But, it is their governments that do not listen to them. So, secular Muslims cannot do anything because if they voice their opinions, they will get tortured,killed or jailed for their opinion of their dislike with their dictatorship regimes and how they are allies with western governments. So they stay quiet. That is why then you have fundamental radical wingnuts who emerge and take things into their own hands and do mental things like go ahead and bomb others to get their point across.

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    Perhaps if the Muslim and non-Muslim communities could have calm, intelligent, respectful debate like this then many of the current problems would be resolved without bloodshed.
    If all the women in this place were laid end to end, I wouldn’t be surprised - Dorothy Parker

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    Mosque. Mecca. Arabs. Halal meat. Allah. Old religion. Dark skin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by A*O View Post
    Perhaps if the Muslim and non-Muslim communities could have calm, intelligent, respectful debate like this then many of the current problems would be resolved without bloodshed.
    You are absolutely right. Communication and understanding is key.

    But in a way,I think us secular Muslims are screwed. We don't want the western interference who are taking advantage of our people,and also we don't want the fundamental crazies to take over and on top of that we hate our dictatorial governments. So,in the Middle East, you have these two extreme forces fighting for power in that region.

    It is a complete mess.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hazeleyed_Honey View Post
    Peace

    Submission to God

    I think of my neighbors; my daughter is good friends with their daughter, and my son's best friend, and family. Wonderful warm people who know we are jewish and totally respect that.

    that is the way it should be.
    Coffee is my happy drug

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    I can't argue with getting the US out of the middle east, they've been fucking it over for the last 60 years, and then the british before that.

    They'll tear each other apart anyway.. unfortunately, a good chunk of Islam is stuck somewhere in the middle ages and is in conflict with much more modern takes on the religion. On top of that, who's bright idea was it to plunk Israel right in the middle of all these feuding nations? yeesh.
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grimmlok View Post
    I can't argue with getting the US out of the middle east, they've been fucking it over for the last 60 years, and then the british before that.

    They'll tear each other apart anyway.. unfortunately, a good chunk of Islam is stuck somewhere in the middle ages and is in conflict with much more modern takes on the religion. On top of that, who's bright idea was it to plunk Israel right in the middle of all these feuding nations? yeesh.
    Well, actually the Allies (us) did it. They literally drew a line in the sand. So arbitrary.

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    It's a strict religion whose rules and tenets I'm not very familiar with. Although I agree with some of the other posters that due to recent world events and press coverage there's sometimes a negative connotation with that word/religion. But then we look at Tom Cruise and see that some other religions maybe have worse p.r. problems.

  14. #29
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    I'm sorry, but when I hear the word Muslim or Islam, lots of negative comes to my mind. I hope things will change also.

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    Well that's cuz it's what you're subjected to day in and day out thanks to the retarded media.
    I am from the American CIA and I have a radio in my head. I am going to kill you.

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