Don't mention the Pope's Hitler Youth past, says the Vatican

**Honey** · May 13th, 2009, 09:12 PM

The Vatican blundered into a fresh public relations fiasco on Tuesday after seeking to rewrite the biography of Pope Benedict XVI by denying that he was ever a member of the Hitler Youth.

Pope Benedict XVI places his note to God in the Western Wall at Judaism's holiest site in Jerusalem's Old City, Israel. Photo: GETTY

The muddle overshadowed the second day of the Pope's visit to Israel and the occupied Palestinian territories, when he visited sacred sites around Jerusalem and sought to bridge the historic divide between Catholicism and Judaism.
Even though the 82-year-old German pontiff has admitted in numerous interviews that he was drafted unwillingly into the Nazi youth movement towards the end of the war, his spokesman came up with another version.

"The Pope was never in the Hitler Youth, never, never, never,'' Father Federico Lombardi, chief spokesman for the Pope, told a press conference in Jerusalem.
Father Lombardi tried to draw a distinction between pro-Nazi Germans who volunteered for the Hitler Youth and young men, like the pontiff, who were forced to join the anti-aircraft unit but who, he claimed, were not necessarily in the Hitler Youth.
But Father Lombardi’s comments contradicted statements the Pope himself has made.
In the 1996 book “Salt of the Earth”, the Pope told Peter Seewald, a German journalist: “At first we weren’t, but when the compulsory Hitler Youth was introduced in 1941, my brother was obliged to join. I was still too young, but later, as a seminarian, I was registered in the HY. As soon as I was out of the seminary I never went back.”
Late yesterday Father Lombardi withdrew his earlier comments, saying that Benedict had, indeed, been forced to join the Hitler Youth.
Father Lombardi made his comments in the wake of a critical response in Israel to the Pope’s choice of language over the Holocaust during the first day of his trip to Israel.

In clarifying his suggestion that the Pope had not been a member of the Hitler Youth, Father Lombardi said he had intended to dispute suggestions in the Israeli media that the Pope had been an enthusiastic Nazi as a boy.
“This fact of the Hitler Youth had no role in his life and in his personality,” Father Lombardi said.
The puzzling claim about the Pope’s membership of the Hitler Youth is the Vatican’s third stumble this year.
In January he caused outrage when he lifted the excommunication of a renegade British Catholic bishop, Richard Williamson, who denied the extent of the Holocaust.
Two months later he was criticised by governments, NGOs and health experts when he said during his first papal visit to Africa that condoms can “aggravate” the Aids crisis.
The Pope began the day with a visit to two of the holiest Muslim and Jewish sites in Jerusalem, where he delivered messages of peace.
In keeping with tradition, he slipped a folded piece of paper bearing a prayer between the ancient stones of the Western Wall, revered by Jews as one of their most sacred shrines.
According to the Vatican, the prayer referred to "Jerusalem, City of Peace, spiritual home to Jews, Christians and Muslims alike'' and asked God to end war.
He was then became the first pontiff to enter the Dome of the Rock mosque, where the Prophet Mohammed is believed to have ascended into heaven.
After meeting Israel's two chief rabbis, Shlomo Amar and Yona Metzger, the Pope sought to send a signal of rapprochement when he said that the Catholic church was "irrevocably committed'' to reconciliation with Jews, tacitly admitting that a gap continues to exist between the two sides.
The first mass of his visit to Israel was held amid tight security in the Kidron Valley, yards from the Garden of Gethsemane where, it is believed, Jesus was betrayed.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...e-Vatican.html

**Grimmlok** · May 13th, 2009, 09:15 PM

Fuck off, PopenFuhrer

**Wiseguy** · May 14th, 2009, 05:56 AM

Ok - we get that you hate the Pope. But I think it's a stretch to imply that he was a Nazi.

Here is a response from a Catholic site I found:

“All of this is despicable smear. The New York Times got it right when it said that the pope ‘was forced into the Hitler Youth and the German Army in World War II.’ Bloomberg.com also got it right when it noted ‘the German pope’s obligatory membership as a 14-year-old in Hitler Youth’; it said further that he ‘didn’t attend meetings and he later deserted when he was drafted into the German army.’

"Moreover, his failure to attend Hitler Youth meetings brought economic hardship to his family: it meant no discounts for school tuition. None of this was a stunt. Furthermore, no one can deny that the pope was coerced into doing what the Nazis demanded of young men at the time.

“Günter Grass and Jürgen Habermas, two German intellectuals loved by the pope’s critics, were also forced to join the Hitler Youth. But because they are left-wing icons, no one implies they are anti-Semitic.

Catholic League: Did the Pope Join Hitler Youth? - Catholic Online

**Chilly Willy** · May 14th, 2009, 08:32 AM

This is funny, I just had a discussion about it last night.

Of course, everone was forced to join the Hitlerjugend back then. But that doesn't mean there were no criminals among them.

A lot of the mindset stuck. And if it didn't, the NAZI collaborators have to prove to me it didn't. You have to show me that you learned your lesson and that you are sensitive and that you can distinguish the right gestures from the wrong gestures.

To pardon Bishop Williams was not the right gesture.

Not to acknowledge the holocaust loud and clear while visting Israel is the wrong gesture.

To beatify Cardinal von Galen is not the right gesture.

Insulting Mohammend in a public speech is not the right gesture.

At the very least this man is a shit-stirrer, or Brandstifter, as we call them.

You can't say he's oblivious, because he's above such wordly things as the holocaust. His gestures are calculated, this man knows damn well what he's doing.

Originally Posted by Wiseguy

Ok - we get that you hate the Pope. But I think it's a stretch to imply that he was a Nazi.

Here is a response from a Catholic site I found:

Catholic League: Did the Pope Join Hitler Youth? - Catholic Online

FYI: Günter Grass was a left wing icon until the public found out that he used to be a member of the SS. HUGE public outcry.

Jürgen Habermas had dedicated his life to exposing mechanism of power and oppression, of course he's above criticism, his attitude is well documented in his work. He never left anyone in doubt, unlike the pope.

The examples are inaccurate. The same goes for the arguments.

The question is not only, what did the pope do back then. The question is also, what does the pope do today. His actions speak for themselves.

I have dealt with old devils like him all my life, I know one when I see one. I hereby cast the first stone.

**Sweetie** · May 14th, 2009, 09:15 AM

He is such a creepy looking man.

**deckchick** · May 14th, 2009, 09:17 AM

I've been following the news stories on this guy. He ain't no JPII.

I will hold the bag of rocks for ya Chilly.

**Charmed Hour** · May 14th, 2009, 01:17 PM

What a misleading photo of the young Pope B above. They cropped out his right arm which also appears to be raised.

Not sure if other Christian faiths do it, but many times during a Catholic Mass the priest will raise his arms in such a manner during prayer or when giving a blessing.

**Grimmlok** · May 14th, 2009, 01:18 PM

you appear to be right

**Charmed Hour** · May 14th, 2009, 01:21 PM

Originally Posted by Grimmlok

you appear to be right

Thanks for finding that. I'm no great lover of the Vatican or this Pope in particular, but editing photos to try to "prove" something is just wrong imo.

**scooter** · May 14th, 2009, 01:22 PM

Originally Posted by Chilly Willy

This is funny, I just had a discussion about it last night.

Of course, everone was forced to join the Hitlerjugend back then. But that doesn't mean there were no criminals among them.

A lot of the mindset stuck. And if it didn't, the NAZI collaborators have to prove to me it didn't. You have to show me that you learned your lesson and that you are sensitive and that you can distinguish the right gestures from the wrong gestures.

To pardon Bishop Williams was not the right gesture.

Not to acknowledge the holocaust loud and clear while visting Israel is the wrong gesture.

To beatify Cardinal von Galen is not the right gesture.

Insulting Mohammend in a public speech is not the right gesture.

At the very least this man is a shit-stirrer, or Brandstifter, as we call them.

You can't say he's oblivious, because he's above such wordly things as the holocaust. His gestures are calculated, this man knows damn well what he's doing.

FYI: Günter Grass was a left wing icon until the public found out that he used to be a member of the SS. HUGE public outcry.

Jürgen Habermas had dedicated his life to exposing mechanism of power and oppression, of course he's above criticism, his attitude is well documented in his work. He never left anyone in doubt, unlike the pope.

The examples are inaccurate. The same goes for the arguments.

The question is not only, what did the pope do back then. The question is also, what does the pope do today. His actions speak for themselves.

I have dealt with old devils like him all my life, I know one when I see one. I hereby cast the first stone.

Exactly so, Chilly. This guy was not the right choice to lead the Church into the new century. The good news is, at his age, we wont have to put up with him for decades. But he certainly has made some spectacular gaffes in the short time he's been Pope.

**Grimmlok** · May 14th, 2009, 01:23 PM

the guy on the left seems cheery.. ratty still seems like a bitchy sourpuss

**kingcap72** · May 14th, 2009, 01:31 PM

Originally Posted by Grimmlok

you appear to be right

They look like they're trying to take flight. Up, up & away.

**Charmed Hour** · May 14th, 2009, 01:31 PM

Originally Posted by scooter

Exactly so, Chilly. This guy was not the right choice to lead the Church into the new century. The good news is, at his age, we wont have to put up with him for decades. But he certainly has made some spectacular gaffes in the short time he's been Pope.

No shit to that. I wonder if he actually got the 2/3 vote or if they had to go with the simple majority. IMO, they needed someone with the "common touch" like JP. Hes a theologian and a hardliner at that. He's rigid in his interpretation of the faith. Major put off to many of us Catholics that ride the fence between belief and lapsing.

**greysfang** · May 14th, 2009, 05:00 PM

Originally Posted by Honey

Pope Benedict XVI places his note to God in the Western Wall at Judaism's holiest site in Jerusalem's Old City, Israel. Photo: GETTY

Why does he have to leave a note in the wall? Isn't he supposed to have a direct hotline to God?

**scooter** · May 14th, 2009, 09:11 PM

Originally Posted by Charmed Hour

No shit to that. I wonder if he actually got the 2/3 vote or if they had to go with the simple majority. IMO, they needed someone with the "common touch" like JP. Hes a theologian and a hardliner at that. He's rigid in his interpretation of the faith. Major put off to many of us Catholics that ride the fence between belief and lapsing.

Indeed he is a hardliner. His prior posting was Prefect for the Congregation of the Doctrine of Faith...called the Inquisition in the Old Days. Remember in History of the World...Mel Brooks dancing around playing Torquemada....We could definately do a remake with this fella.