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Thread: Family cleared in JonBenet Ramsey's death

  1. #76
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    A man named Macky Boykin was sent to prison for molesting Nancy when she was about 12 yrs old.

    Nancy claimed that Macky was the appointed one in the cult to actually "strangle" the children to elicit a sexual response.

    Now consider this-her mother Gwen later married Macky's brother. Macky died in November of 1995 in Gwen's house.

    Ask youself-what kind of family stays so close to the convicted molester of one of their children?

    Nancy did go to the police, in San Luis Obispo, California and tried to tell them what her family was up to. The police questioned her family, who called Nancy crazy, of course. The California police then dismissed Nancy as "unstable" and the Boulder police used this to discredit her and to discount her story.

    Nancy claims that John Ramsey was close to the White family for years before the murder, and that he was the one, during Nancy's childhood, who filmed the pedophilic abuse and distributed it for profit for the benefit of the cult.

    Now you have to remember that John Ramsey was a very high Muckety Muck. His company, Access Graphics, was a subsidiary of Lockhead Martin. Child porn was found to have been downloaded to computers at Access Graphics.

    To the poster above who said that child porn was never found at the Ramsey's: We DO NOT know that, we cannot-the records are sealed.

    That said I didn't finish reading the transcript and have no idea who Fleet White Sr, Jr., or III are.
    Fleet Jr. was with John Ramsey when JonBenet's body was found. His son is III, who I think is about Burke's age. Fleet Sr. is the one alleged by Nancy as the one who abused her the most during her childhood. Fleet Sr. is the Godfather to Nancy's mother Gwen.

    Here are the verified connections of Nancy to the White family:

    Web Archive
    Last edited by Sasha; July 10th, 2008 at 11:00 PM.

  2. #77
    Elite Member sweetness's Avatar
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    What doesn't make sense to me is that Nancy said the last time FW Sr. sexually abused her was in 1990.
    By that time she was 28 years old and he was probably around 70.

    After years of childhood abuse, why would she go around him as an adult?

    And why wouldn't a 28 year old woman be able to fight off a 70 something year old man?

  3. #78
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    sweetness, after years of abuse and threats Nancy was beaten down. She thought she had to comply with the demands of Fleet Sr., who was the highest ranking male in the cult. Children in these cults are taught, nay forced to learn, that the word of these high-ranking males is the law.

    During her years of abuse, her life was threatened, her pets were threatened. She was brutally raped from the age of three. This cult practiced (or practices, God forbid-they have not been held to account) what is called "trauma based mind control" and only intensive therapy can undo such programming, which eventually Nancy did recieve. This is the only reason Nancy had the wherewithal to come forward and tell her story, despite threats to herself and her therapist, Mary Bienkowski.

    Ms. Bienkowski turned over Nancy's therapy records to the Boulder Police, with Nancy's persmission, which documented her abuse and named names years before JonBenet was murdered.

    eta: Link to story concerning calls to Nancy's therapist from her family members.
    Last edited by Sasha; July 10th, 2008 at 11:28 PM.

  4. #79
    Elite Member sweetness's Avatar
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    ^^ Well okay, I can kind of see that. If what she's saying is really true my heart goes out to her.

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    Gold Member powerorchid's Avatar
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    Hmmm it doesn't really add up to me. If it is a child porn ring isn't a 28 year old a little too old for child porn. And didn't John Ramsey move to that town from some-where else? How old was John Ramsey he when she was a child and being filmed? If she was filmed as a child and she recognised John Ramsey how old would he have been at the time? I'd like to work out those things first before I took what she is saying seriously.

    I remember when that guy came forward saying that he was the one who killed JB. I spent a couple of weeks reading all the facts. Some things that stand out to me:

    Patsy's shirt fibers were found to be entwined into the garrote. It was the shirt she wore the night before and the next day (she put the same clothes on)

    The video camera was set up in the family room but had no film and no film was ever found of Christmas day.

    The garrote was not used - the cause of death was a blow to the head. The garrote was just staged. I am not even sure if the garrote was usable and that they placed it right.

    The underwear JB was wearing was too large (wouldn't have stayed up if she stood up) and was brand new. DNA was found on them but as people have said - it could have come from a factory worker in China.

    John Ramseys shirt fibres were found on the underwear.

    The first thing Patsy said to the detectives when she was questioned was "I didn't kill my baby"

    The ransom note was in Patsys lingo, handwriting and had inside knowledge.

    Fleet White said that as he entered the basement with John Ramsey because of the change of light he did not see/make out the body - yet John went "oh no" and went straight toward it. Fleet Whites friendship ended soon after the first few days. (presumably when he realized John had something to do with the murder.)

    So to me there is so much evidence that implicates the Ramseys. I just can't imagine that an intruder did it. There is alot of forensic evidence that points towards the Ramseys. Fleet White has always acted as some-one who was innocent. If they were in it together they would have stuck together to avoid prosecution.

  6. #81
    Elite Member Beeyotch's Avatar
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    I don't think that his evident suspicion of the Ramseys necessarily means that Fleet White was innocent. It could be just a means to deflect suspicion away from him. It still could have been any or all of them, Fleet White, John Ramsey or Patsy.

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    Gold Member powerorchid's Avatar
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    okay I looked it up on wikipedea. The Ramseys moved to Colorado when Jon Benet was 9 months old.
    Jon Benet was born in August 1990 so they moved to Colorado in 1991.

    Nancys last abuse was 1990. and she claimed that her "Childhood abuse" was filmed by John Ramsey. Who hadn't even moved to that town yet and would not have even met Fleet White yet.

  8. #83
    Elite Member msdeb's Avatar
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    i never thought the parents did it. i have nothing to base those thoughts on. the entire thing is a tragedy
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    Something tells me that if JonBenet was alive today, her mother would of had her looking like Michael Jackson in a miniskirt. Poor kid, to have been born to pageant parents like that.
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  10. #85
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    ^Yep, that poor girl's future had already been mapped out for her. She had her innocence stolen from her.

    Here's some interesting questions to think about, mostly for people who think the Ramseys are honest and innocent.
    This comes from- http://www.geocities.com/Area51/nebu.../jonbenet.html

    WHY?....

    Was Patsy Ramsey fully dressed including face make-up when she met the police after the 911 call?


    Was she dressed in the same clothes she wore to the White's Christmas Dinner the night before?


    Did her father pick up a telephone and schedule a "remaining family" trip to Atlanta that afternoon only 37 minutes after finding her body?
    [i]They didn't want to stay and cooperate with police; if that doesn't scream 'something to hide' what does!!??!

    Would John Ramsey close an open window in the basement when he knew the police would be searching for an "intruder?


    Did the Ramsey's refuse lie detector tests months after the murder? John said he was insulted with the request and Patsy agreed and then refused.
    I'm sorry but if you aren't guilty, you'd take the test. You'd want to be CLEARED IMMEDIATELY.


    Did JonBenet visit the doctor almost 30 times in three years?


    Did John Ramsey appear much more angry and upset over the alligation of sexual abuse than the actual murder and loss of his daughter?


    Did Nedra, Patsy's mother, state that the handwriting on the ransom note looked like Patsy's?


    Was her body wiped down and her clothes found to be those other than the ones Patsy claimed she wore to bed?


    Was the neck noose pulled tightly around her neck and the wrist cord loose?


    Was pineapple found in JonBenet's intestines when Patsy Ramsey said JonBenet ate no pineapple?
    [i]Oh i suppose the killer fed her too; he had all the time in the world after all.


    Were fibers connected to Patsy Ramsey's clothing found on the murder duct tape?
    VERY WEIRD INDEED.


    Did Patsy's Mother and Father remain in Atlanta choosing not to personally comfort their daughter when they heard of JonBenet's murder?


    Why were photos of JonBenet found in the trash left at the Boulder house after the move to Atlanta?


    Was there the smell of peroxide in JonBenet's bathroom when the police arrived? Go to your own bathroom and smell your bottle of peroxide. There is no odor. There would be odor if the peroxide was mixed with other chemicals for hair color.
    This shows Patsy was a liar; Patsy said the sun bleached Jonbenet's hair. Why lie?


    There's so many other questions left unanswered. I think the killer is already dead; patsy. Or at least she took a huge secret to her grave.

  11. #86
    Elite Member JuicyLucy's Avatar
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    Poor JonBenet. What an adorable little girl, with such an insane mother.
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  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by sweetness View Post
    What doesn't make sense to me is that Nancy said the last time FW Sr. sexually abused her was in 1990.
    By that time she was 28 years old and he was probably around 70.

    After years of childhood abuse, why would she go around him as an adult?

    And why wouldn't a 28 year old woman be able to fight off a 70 something year old man?
    Bingo.
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    Quote Originally Posted by powerorchid View Post
    Hmmm it doesn't really add up to me. If it is a child porn ring isn't a 28 year old a little too old for child porn. And didn't John Ramsey move to that town from some-where else? How old was John Ramsey he when she was a child and being filmed? If she was filmed as a child and she recognised John Ramsey how old would he have been at the time? I'd like to work out those things first before I took what she is saying seriously.
    She wasn't being used for child porn at that time, obviously. These people were into power and control and just because they were pedophiles didn't mean they above using their child victims once they became adults.


    Quote Originally Posted by powerorchid
    Patsy's shirt fibers were found to be entwined into the garrote. It was the shirt she wore the night before and the next day (she put the same clothes on)

    The video camera was set up in the family room but had no film and no film was ever found of Christmas day.
    Absolutely. Nothing in the evidence I have presented here exonerates Patsy. Obviously, if they were involved in a child porn ring and their child was killed as a result of their activities they would be forced to cover it up. The forensic evidence would necessarily refect that.


    Quote Originally Posted by powerorchid
    The garrote was not used - the cause of death was a blow to the head. The garrote was just staged. I am not even sure if the garrote was usable and that they placed it right.
    The garrotte was not used, but the cause of death was strangulation. As I explained above the blow to the head produced so little blood she had to be dead or near dead when it occurred. From the autopsy report linked above:

    FINAL DIAGNOSIS:

    I. Ligature strangulation



    A. Circumferential ligature with associated ligature furrow of neck

    B. Abrasions and petechial hemorrhages, neck

    C. Petechial hemorrhages, conjunctival surfaces of eyes and skin of face
    Quote Originally Posted by powerorchid
    The underwear JB was wearing was too large (wouldn't have stayed up if she stood up) and was brand new. DNA was found on them but as people have said - it could have come from a factory worker in China.
    That is why I don't trust the "clearing" of the Ramsey's

    Quote Originally Posted by powerorchid
    John Ramseys shirt fibres were found on the underwear.

    The first thing Patsy said to the detectives when she was questioned was "I didn't kill my baby"

    The ransom note was in Patsys lingo, handwriting and had inside knowledge.
    Like I said, nothing has cleared the Ramsey's in my mind.


    Quote Originally Posted by powerorchid
    So to me there is so much evidence that implicates the Ramseys. I just can't imagine that an intruder did it. There is alot of forensic evidence that points towards the Ramseys. Fleet White has always acted as some-one who was innocent. If they were in it together they would have stuck together to avoid prosecution
    I don't think an intruder did it either. I think she died at the White's Christmas "Party" (a full set of photos from that party have never been released to the public)(ask victims of these sorts of cults how they use holidays as a cover for their activities) and the Ramsey's were forced to take her home and attempt a cover-up

    Quote Originally Posted by powerorchid View Post
    okay I looked it up on wikipedea. The Ramseys moved to Colorado when Jon Benet was 9 months old.
    Jon Benet was born in August 1990 so they moved to Colorado in 1991.

    Nancys last abuse was 1990. and she claimed that her "Childhood abuse" was filmed by John Ramsey. Who hadn't even moved to that town yet and would not have even met Fleet White yet.
    Ramsey say's he never met Fleet White and the police never tried to track Nancy's claims to the contrary, which would have been useful. But Nancy never claimed her abuse took place in Colorado. She was from California and so were White's. Sr. and his wife still lived there at the time of JonBenet's murder. Ramsey had a grandmother in Oregon who was still living in the 1970's. It is not beyond the realm of possiblity he would have had occasion to be on the West Coast periodically during that time. Nancy never claimed he lived there or that he was present for every bit of abuse she suffered.

  14. #89
    Elite Member Trixie's Avatar
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    I don't claim any extensive knowledge of this case, but agree the new DNA evidence doesn't "clear" the Ramseys, or anyone else for that matter.

    First, Mary Lacy comes up with John Mark Karr, (talk about a joke and a waste of taxpayer money) then this? Why is she so hellbent on clearing the Ramseys anyway?

  15. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raspberry gashes View Post



    Did the Ramsey's refuse lie detector tests months after the murder? John said he was insulted with the request and Patsy agreed and then refused.
    I'm sorry but if you aren't guilty, you'd take the test. You'd want to be CLEARED IMMEDIATELY.
    .
    They did take a test.
    Ramseys pass lie detector tests

    It says they refused the test by the FBI because they (FBI) assisted the Boulder police. So they got another respected polygrapher to give them a test. Make of that what you will. I can sort of see their point, as they could think the police test would be fixed as the police were so set on them being guilty.

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