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Thread: Lipodissolve scam and spam

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    Elite Member twitchy's Avatar
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    Thumbs down Lipodissolve scam and spam

    Lipodissolve looks like a crock. (Yeah this is big. Feel free to just read the first bit or skim.)

    It involves the injection of chemicals into the body to kill fat. The chemicals are NOT FDA approved. Companies like fig. say that the rules don't apply to them. "Pharmacies are permitted to compound drugs pursuant to a valid patient/physician/pharmacist relationship - even if the drugs have not been approved by the FDA." they say on their website. Wherever I look at reviews, they are overwhelmingly negative. Like here:
    Lipodissolve was NOT worth it : Advanced lipodissolve (fig.) has to be stopped...
    Lipodissolve questions


    Many of the stories seem to be reporting the same symptoms: discoloured skin, weight gain, hives, fatigue, fluid retention, lumpiness, pain etc.

    .................................................. .............
    Fat-Melting Mayhem

    "Piece of cake..." "I could not be happier..." "Did not hurt whatsoever..." Who is saying this about the fat-melting shots called lipodissolve? You may be surprised.

    By Joan Kron


    Women who read "Fat Chance" [Allure, November], about fat-melting injections, may be surprised to learn that employees working for some clinics that offer the controversial fat-melting shots lipodissolve have been submitting positive reviews about the experience on the Internet. *AKA FUCKING SPAMMERS* RealSelf.com, a skin-care and cosmetic surgery website, received these submissions, and alerted Allure.


    Lipodissolve uses chemicals that are not FDA-approved for injection under the skin. The Kansas State Board of Healing Arts tried to greatly restrict its use this summer, after receiving numerous complaints. (Its use is already prohibited in Brazil and Canada—and doctors using the lipodissolve procedure in the United Kingdom can no longer seek malpractice coverage from the Medical Protection Society.) In an October 9, 2007 news release issued by the St. Louis Better Business Bureau, where 90 complaints about lipodissolve have been received this year, the BBB stated that complainants "allege the procedure is ineffective and caused swelling and pain," and that Fig (formerly known as Advanced Lipo Dissolve), a major chain of lipodissolve clinics, made it difficult for them to "obtain refunds."

    Essentially, lipodissolve clinics are practicing "human experimentation, due to the lack of significant data to support the claims to the consumer," says Rod Rohrich, chief of plastic surgery at the University of Texas, Southwest Medical Center.

    Meanwhile, the editors of RealSelf.com received approximately 109 comments on the treatment—61 percent of which are negative; 39 percent positive. RealSelf.com suspected that several of the positive submissions might have been written by the people at companies that offer lipodissolve. A trace of computer IP addresses then revealed that the majority of these statements stemmed from employees of Fig, and a few came from employees of another lipodissolve clinic, MedSculpt. Both are clinics with multiple locations in the United States.

    When asked to respond to these accusations, Fig's chief marketing officer, Rob Marandino, sent Allure a statement dated October 23, 2007, saying, "Several months ago, it became clear that current and prospective lipodissolve patients were actively utilizing the online space to post queries about the procedure, treatment expectations, and their own personal experiences. Many Fig employees and satisfied Fig patients responded to queries to provide accurate information about the procedure, address concerns, and share their own experiences.

    "We quickly realized, through numerous conversations with the editorial staff of RealSelf.com that although some Fig employees were appropriately representing themselves and their professional affiliation, others were not. This clearly violates our company's online communications policy, which ensures transparency and accuracy, and all employees were reminded of our stringent guidelines. To our knowledge, this situation was resolved, and Fig employees are properly representing ourselves in online posts...We will continue to work with RealSelf.com to ensure that we are meeting its terms of use."

    MedSculpt Chief Executive Officer Gary F. Jonas emailed Allure on October 24, 2007, saying, "It was not the intention of any of our employees to mislead the public in any way, and as of today, we will send out a policy statement indicating that any blog posting by them should indicate that they are currently a [MedSculpt] employee—even if their treatments may have occurred prior to employment...I can assure you that any subsequent submission to blogs will state that they are employees."

    The bottom line: No matter what these companies' policies state, potential lipodissolve patients have no way of verifying the authenticity of any user-generated post about the procedure they read online—so they should be skeptical. In fact, visitors' reactions on RealSelf.com demonstrate that people are often "suspicious of glowingly positive reviews," says Eric Kennedy, head of product for the site.
    To learn more about lipodissolve, read "Fat Chance" in the November issue of Allure, and the ASAPS's warning about fat-melting injections
    Fat-Melting Mayhem: Inside Allure: allure.com


    .................................................. ........
    Can you dissolve fat away?
    Updated: Nov 5, 2007 01:01 PM

    It's touted as an easy way to fix your body without surgery. Maybe you've heard of Lipo- Dissolve. Maybe you've even considered doing it. But does it work and, more importantly, is it safe?

    Some people are raising serious questions about Lipo-Dissolve. It's a hot new thing in the world of cosmetic treatments. Britney Spears is even rumored to have undergone the procedure here in the valley. But is it as simple as it sounds?

    "I've done walking, tapes to do. I've done everything and it didn't seem to go."

    Alison Nolan paid $6,000 for Lipo-Dissolve to flatten her tummy. But her dreams of a better body turned into a nightmare. "It looked black and blue when the lumps came up. At first it was all red then it bruised up. It was nasty."

    Alison went to Advanced Lipo Dissolve, now called fig. You've probably heard their ads or seen them around town. Patients undergo a series of shots over several months. Patients are encouraged to exercise and make healthy food choices.

    The company says most clients are happy with their results. "I've already lost two and a quarter inches off my abdomen and an inch on one thigh and a half an inch off the other," said one patient.

    The patients are injected with a compound called PCDC. It's supposed to dissolve fat cells, which are then excreted through natural body processes.
    "There are side effects that can happen with any injectable formula," says Dr. John Minoli. 85,000 treatments is a lot. I personally have been involved with thousands myself. Have yet to see, rare inflammatory responses, rare."
    We sent a News 3 producer and photographer into fig. with hidden cameras. The staff did tell us about potential risks, but downplayed them. They encouraged our producer to start treatments right away.

    fig. rep on hidden camera: After you do find out information about it, what would stop you from starting today and getting rid of those fat cells? I've personally done it and I'm pregnant right now, and I'm not worried at all about anything

    But plastic surgeon Dr. Julio Garcia is worried. He won't even consider doing Lipo-Dissolve on his valley patients. "We don't know if this material gets absorbed into the body, what its potential effects are."

    Dr. Garcia says there's no credible scientific evidence lipo dissolve is safe. "It's a large scale, unconsented experiment on people who don't know they're being experimented on."

    fig. says all of its procedures are overseen by a medically trained staff member, often a nurse practitioner. But when Alison developed complications, she and her husband tell us the nurse didn't recognize what was wrong and they never saw a doctor. "There was no 'we'd like to see her and do follow up work,' no cause for patient care whatsoever, they dropped her like a rock," says Alison's husband, Chris.

    A study fig. provided Healthline 3 of 17,000 patients found no serious complications or deaths from Lipo-Dissolve. But it also offered modest results. The study actually says the vast majority of patients reported a one centimeters thickness reduction.

    It sounded good to Alison, until she ended up in the emergency room. She had developed abscesses, which are listed on the consent forms as a possible risk. Her abscesses had to be lanced and packed as open wounds, leading to a painful recovery.

    Weeks later, Alison still couldn't bend over to tie her shoes. "This process is dangerous, women need to know what they're getting themselves into," Chris insists.

    Beth: A lot of women have a nagging area and are thinking about doing this. Would you do this again?
    Alison: No, no.
    Beth:Why not?
    Alison: 'cause it hurts too much.
    fig. is not the only facility in the valley offering Lipo-Dissolve or similar procedures. The price varies from patient to patient, depending on what they have done. The drugs used in Lipo- Dissolve are not FDA approved for this use. And Dr. Garcia tells us the American Society of Plastic Surgeons does not support their use.
    Can you dissolve fat away?
    .................................................. ............

    "But is lipo-dissolve safe? That's the subject of serious debate. Dr. Michael Edwards is a plastic surgeon in Summerlin. He says the biggest concern is simply what's not known about the procedure's effects. "We don't know (the effects). By 'we' I mean the physicians who like to base their practice on science, don't know what the long term effects are of disrupting fat cells."
    Lipo-dissolve is not FDA approved, but the government is looking into it. In the meantime, the FDA tells us it cannot assure the safety and efficacy of these types of drugs.
    Several doctors tell us the procedure has already been banned in Brazil. "It baffles me why one country (Brazil) takes a product off and then it's used here," plastic surgeon Dr. Julio Garcia told Healthline 3.
    Both Dr. Edwards and Dr. Garcia want to see more research done. "It'd be like experimenting on you, if I were to do it now, and I can't stomach that," Dr. Edwards said."
    "And, in order to get a refund patients must sign a document which says they won't talk about their experience at fig. That's why some were hesitant to go on camera."
    Patients recount experiences with lipo-dissolve company

    .................................................. .................................................

    An exerpt from an interview with Dr. Michael Olding
    Chief of Plastic Surgery, George Washington University
    :

    "Daviston, Ala.: How can shots that dissolve fat not damage other tissue and cause necrosis?
    Dr. Michael Olding: Exactly.... they can... If injected into the skin, it can kill the skin.... thus one of the potential complications. What is injected is a liquid and therefore it is important that it be injected only in the fat layer. I believe that precise placement of the "cocktail" that is injected is undoubtedly difficult." Eeep!
    Does Lipo-dissolve Work? - washingtonpost.com
    .............................................

    "In fact, the FDA has even issued warning letters against those marketing and distributing these injectable “fat-dissolving” products. In a July 22, 2003 warning letter, for instance, the FDA specifically said that claims that these products are legal to sell and inject because they are “nutritional supplements and hence don’t fall under FDA’s jurisdiction” were false. As John M. Taylor, Associate Commissioner for Regulatory Affairs at the FDA, explained: “Congress defined the term dietary supplement as a product that... is ingested, is intended to supplement the diet, [and] is labeled as a dietary supplement.” Since Lipodissolve is injected, it is a drug... and an unapproved one, at that. Yet, Lipodissolve is growing in popularity. It’s proven irresistibly lucrative for the estimated 10,000 anti-aging spas and cosmetic plastic surgeon offices around the country now offering them.
    Doctors can make $375 to $1,500 per treatment, with up to six treatments required, according to Dr. Alan Matarasso, M.D., FACS, a New York City board-certified plastic surgeon.
    As Lisa Nicita reported in the Arizona Republic, since it’s unregulated, doctors don’t have to report adverse outcomes to anyone and also don’t have to be registered with a board:
    [P]hysicians can be trained on the procedure at seminars, such as those held at the Academy of Aesthetic Medicine in Tempe, Ariz. For about $2,500, physicians receive eight hours of hands-on training, a certificate of training and a starter kit of supplies. Anyone can purchase a kit online for less than $400."

    "Lipodissolve contains phosphatidylcholine (PPC) sodium deoxycholate (DC) along with any number of other ingredients, depending on the doctor or clinic, said Dr. Matarasso. Each doctor creates his/her own cocktail.
    The New Technologies Subcommittee on Fat Transfer and Liposuction for the American Society for Dermatologic Surgery examined the research on these injectables and issued a Technology Report last year. They found that there was no standardization in formulas being used and they contain things like “prescription medications — vasodilators, antibiotics, the caffeine, aminophylline, hormones like calcitonin and thyroxin and the beta agonist, isoproterenol, enzymes (collagenase and hyaluronidase), herbal extracts, vitamins and minerals.” Most all, though, contain a soy lecithin extract, phosphatidylcholine, (Sanofi-Aventis):
    Initially it was thought that this was the responsible agent for the nonspecific lysis of cell membranes — emulsification of fat cells (lipolysis) — and the cause for fat reduction. However, recent data suggests that the cell lysis may in fact be due to the action of deoxycholate, a natural detergent used in these formulations.


    These solutions are injected into the subcutaneous fat using needles or mesoguns (which have also not been approved by the FDA for safe use in the U.S. But they don’t actually “melt” or “dissolve” fat as is claimed in advertising, according to the American Society for Aesthetic Plastic Surgery:
    Instead, PPC and/or DC appear to kill (lyse) adipocytes. It has been hypothesized that treatment with phosphatidylcholine and deoxycholate reduces subcutaneous fat either by adipocyte necrosis due to direct toxic or surfactant effects, or by mobilization of triglycerides secondary to activation of hormone sensitive lipase. Studies have found that subcutaneous adipose tissue following PPC/DC treatments shows evidence of nodules of fat necrosis, threadlike strands of scar tissue, cell-wall disruption, focal inflammation, and collagen deposition.
    To date, however, there is no objective data on precisely how these injections work, but there are numerous reports of complications documented in the medical literature, including bacterial infection, granulomas (disfiguring masses of chronically inflamed tissue) and localized necrosis (tissue death), said the ASAPS.
    “[P]resently, there are no randomized, double-blinded controlled studies in the literature that unequivocally establish the safety and efficacy of this procedure for medical or aesthetic conditions,” concluded the ASDS Technology Report. Lipodissolve is currently being investigated in a randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled clinical trial under FDA supervision.
    "[T]he long-term effects of Lipodissolve have not been established,” said Dr. Matarasso. “Because different doctors use different ingredients, it is difficult to give a meaningful prediction of results from past procedures. There are no significant studies demonstrating where the medication travels or how it may affect organs, what the proper dosage or ingredient requirement is, the short term side effects, or long-term complications.” Until adequate safety and efficacy information is available, the FDA won’t approved it for cosmetic use. “The FDA requires much more supporting data than is required in Europe,” he explained. He especially cautioned that Lipodissolve “should not be used for pregnant women, nursing mothers, obese patients; or people with diabetes, autoimmune diseases, vascular complications, or infections of any kind.”
    “Safety needs to come first. We do not have definitive information on injection fat loss treatments. All we have is a few small studies and anecdotal evidence. Until we know more, we cannot recommend these procedures to patients,” Foad Nahai, M.D., president of the ASAPS told Medical News Today. “The bottom line for patients is this: Don’t allow yourself to be injected with an unknown and untested substance.”"


    Junkfood Science: €œLunch time Lipo€
    ................................................

    Even if this stuff is safe, there's no guarantee as to its efficacy.


    Histologic response to injected phosphatidylcholine in fat tissue: experimental study in a new rabbit model.

    Salles AG, Valler CS, Ferreira MC.
    Division of Plastic Surgery, Faculty of Medicine, University of So Paulo, So Paulo, Brasil. agsalles@uol.com.br
    The application of phosphatidylcholine to the fat tissue of humans for aesthetic purposes has recently been in evidence, despite the sparse literature corroboration of this practice. The authors developed a new experimental model to study injection of substances in fat tissue in rabbits. The objective of this particular study was to verify the possible effects of phosphatidylcholine injected in the animals. The animal weight, the fat pad weight, the presence of inflammatory infiltrate, and fibrosis and necrosis at the application sites were observed. Two groups of rabbits received five weekly applications to the dorsal fat pad. The control group received saline solution 0.9%, and the study group received phosphatidylcholine. The removed fat tissue was evaluated 3, 7, 14, and 21 days after the fifth application was completed. The phosphatidylcholine group presented more intense inflammatory infiltrate and fibrosis than the control group (p = 0.05). Necrosis was not observed in any animal. There was no statistically significant difference with regard to the weights of the animal or the fat pad. On the basis of this study, the injection of phosphatidylcholine is relatively safe, but no effect was observed regarding the reduction of fat tissue volume. New studies with higher doses are needed to justify the clinical use of this substance.
    PMID: 16855889 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
    Histologic response to injected phosphatidylcholin...[Aesthetic Plast Surg. 2006 Jul-Aug] - PubMed Result

    .........................................
    "The Better Business Bureau's St. Louis office has received more than 100 customer complaints about Maryland Heights-based Fig., formerly known as Advanced LipoDissolve, since March 2006. Missouri Attorney General Jay Nixon's office has logged 37 complaints since Fig. opened its first clinic in Chesterfield in 2005. Another dozen or so complaints have been filed with Nixon's counterpart in Kansas in recent months. The calls and reports range from cases involving painful side effects of treatment to a lack of cosmetic results to delayed refund payments associated with the firm's money-back guarantee."
    At Fig., growth comes with stretch marks - St. Louis Business Journal:
    ....................
    So, in conclusion, fuck you fig. (and your competitors) with a rusty chainsaw. If your product and your technique was "all that", you'd have it nicely legalized and you wouldn't need to spam forums to promote your shit. Unethical little bastards. DIAF





    "The howling backwoods that is IMDB is where film criticism goes to die (and then have its corpse gang-raped, called a racist, and accused of supporting Al-Qaeda)" ----Sean O'Neal, The Onion AV Club

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    Hit By Ban Bus! DVS_one's Avatar
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    And I love that you used the expression DIAF...

    O but if anyone wants any, send me your $29.99 and Ill get yours to you STAT. (I will..... *wink)

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    Bronze Member cupcake9's Avatar
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    Heard so many radio ads for this recently

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    Elite Member twitchy's Avatar
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    Yes. They're pretty aggressive with their marketing. Apparently the BBB gets quite a lot of complaints about their high pressure sales tactics. Going on to forums to give fake positive reviews is just scummy though.

    "The howling backwoods that is IMDB is where film criticism goes to die (and then have its corpse gang-raped, called a racist, and accused of supporting Al-Qaeda)" ----Sean O'Neal, The Onion AV Club

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    Bronze Member cupcake9's Avatar
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    I didn't know about the fake forum reviews. Thanks.

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    Elite Member dangerous's Avatar
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    I see the advertisements for this on TV all the time. It seems
    pretty scary after reading all this-thanks for the info.

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    Elite Member celeb_2006's Avatar
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    Yea great info. I admit to being intrigued by this, it's called mesotherapy in my area.

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    Hit By Ban Bus! AliceInWonderland's Avatar
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    well yeah if britney spears relies on it then it must be a crock!

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    Elite Member dakodas's Avatar
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    I am actually having mesotherapy this morning at 10:30 on my stomach. An MD is performing it and she had many before/after pics of her patients to support the use of mesotherapy. She will be taking before and after pics on me so we willl see...it is just that I have done aerobic exercise and crunches and lifts on an ab board like crazy for months and my stomach is just holding on to the fat. I will provide an update later today. She said there could be bruising and swelling but that it could be treated with Benadryl. Because of the number of medications I am taking she is only going to perform the procedure once a month on me until I get my desired results, instead of every 2 weeks like on her other patients. I am paying 500 dollars a treatment.

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    Elite Member dakodas's Avatar
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    I look like I have 100's of mosquito bites on my stomach from all the shots. THey rub lidocaine all over your stomach and wrap you in saran wrap for 45 minutes before the shots. I can't tell if I feel bad or not since I am just now getting some coffee in me.

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    Elite Member TonjaLasagna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dakodas View Post
    They rub lidocaine all over your stomach and wrap you in saran wrap for 45 minutes before the shots
    That sounds odd and more like a spa treatment.
    I just received a treatment of Lipodissolve this afternoon.
    Two years ago I had a small area treated on film (local news crew did a story on it). I didn't notice a difference with the miniature treatment.
    This time the doctor said I should notice something in a few days, but I have to return in 6 weeks for a second treatment.

    I'll let you know if it works
    "the place you live in is that much more drab and empty that they're gone"

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    Elite Member TonjaLasagna's Avatar
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    The treated area has doubled in size and is very tender. I can't rest my laptop near it. The doctor said it would stay like this for approx 4 days before it starts to subside.
    "the place you live in is that much more drab and empty that they're gone"

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    Elite Member AllieCat's Avatar
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    Idk, wouldn't it be cheaper, and more effective to just get liposuction, or even a tummy tuck? 500 bucks a pop sounds like a rip, and it's not even guaranteed to work.

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    Hit By Ban Bus! AliceInWonderland's Avatar
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    yeah and it'd be even cheaper to get your ass in the gym and do it yourself too.

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    Super Moderator twitchy2.0's Avatar
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    Interesting that the company whose spammer joined here (prompting me to start this thread in the first place), has gone belly up. Fig. closes door on Lipodissolve - St. Louis Business Journal: I'd like to think that my DIAF had something to do with it. I remember watching the twit go back and forth, starting a new thread then coming back here to this one. I think it eventually gave up without posting.
    As Canadian as possible under the circumstances

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